What is 'faith' and why do we need it?

by AK - Jeff 20 Replies latest jw friends

  • AK - Jeff
    AK - Jeff

    I posted these thoughts on another, shall we say, less populous forum. I am intrigued by the matter, but not really seeking answers. I post it here:

    I was pondering this matter some yesterday.

    Why would God expect us to display faith? Either the reality of Him/Jesus or whomever ones professes 'faith' in, would be clear and obvious, or it wouldn't be clear and obvious. Seems to me that 'faith' would only be needed to mentally clarify something that is not readily clear without. If we believe in God, that is not enough. We must have 'faith' that what is stated about him is true, what is prophesied is sure to occur, what is expected for the future of our souls is sure? But examination of the source that claims that Jesus was God/Man is dubious to many.

    The words were not written at the moment of the events, but many years and sometimes centuries later. Holes can be punched in much of the Bible, Koran, and other holy writ. Much of what is written there conflicts, depending on the document that you choose to be Holy to you. Hence the 'faith' of Muslims and Jews and Christians is far different. Further, the document that has been preserved [as in the Bible], is seemingly just a portion, a very small one at that, of what what written at the time by the men of faith in the audience. That portion was selected by men to be canonized. That canon appears to be in severe contrast with much of what was written by contemporaries. What if we put 'faith' in the other writings, writings that attempt to explain God/Christ in other terms or manners. The Gnostic writings are 180 degree in opposition to much of what we read in the Bible for example. Yet the Gnostics claim faith in those writings, while the Christians, Muslims and Jews would view them as 'infidels' perhaps.

    What if our faith is not bound to the written word of men, we don't trust them as keepers of our faith, as men worthy of safe transmission of the words? Then what? Further - why would God care what I believe? Unless he has made it so crystal clear that to believe a particular system as true is without question? Why has such a maze of possibilities become a minefield that will result in everlasting loss to those unable to charter it well and find the nuggets of truth that elude the majority? Once one has grasped that nugget in hand, without the tools of absolute assay, how does he know that he does not hold fools gold, and that it will be revealed only as he stands before the judgement to found unworthy?

    Even those who claim greater proof, those who see blood flow from the statues, those who see signs in stars and heaven, those who read leaves and feel the presence of great spirits, those who speak in tongues that have not been spoken, even these are discounted by those of other faiths as 'demonic' 'unclean', or perhaps mistaken. While the discounter continues to feel secure in his/her hope and faith of matters that he cannot prove or see or touch, because his faith is bound into the word that was transmitted by other men, edited by other men, preserved and translated by other men, about a man who remains dubious to many who examine the evidence that exists?

    Just the ramblings of a man. Thanx for letting me.

    Jeff

  • BurnTheShips
    BurnTheShips

    I like the way Carl Jung put it:

    I could not say I believe— I know! I have had the experience of being gripped by something that is stronger than myself, something that people call God.

    BTS

  • AK - Jeff
    AK - Jeff

    That is my point BTS. How do you know? Most people's faith is tied up in proof that is not proof.

    Jeff

  • White Dove
    White Dove

    I don't believe that I need faith in anything at all. I simply live and enjoy life and work good toward others. I work with what I have and am not hopeless. I'm not a sinner in need of a savior, therefor, I don't need faith. I have things in my personality that need work, as we all do. Faith implies that you are expecting something and I'm not.

  • AK - Jeff
    AK - Jeff

    Agreed WD

  • AllTimeJeff
    AllTimeJeff

    This is why, in my view, "faith" should be a very personal matter. Beware of a group that tells you what to put faith in.

    I prefer the word "spirituality", because I sense in all of us a desire for purpose and direction in our individual lives. To yearn for a higher purpose is noble, and many do put faith in their own idea of a higher power. As long as that is personal, and especially if there is no preaching or evangelizing involved, then be my guest.

    Just be honest and admit what you can prove, and try not to link it into what you can't prove and must therefore put "faith" in. Intellectual honesty has often been lacking in a discussion of this debate.

    However, "faith" and its more broader tenant of "spirituality" is very important to all of us.

  • White Dove
    White Dove

    Yes, I don't give a hoot about faith, but cherish spirituality. To me, spirituality is introspection at it's finest. Spirituality done this way allows me to see inside myself and know myself better. When I know myself better, I can make my life just how I want it (yes, time and unforseen occurance is a bitch!). When we really know ourselves and act on that knowledge, we can steer "time and unforseen occurance" to a degree.

    Faith in another? Don't need it. Hope for a better tomorrow? Depends on if you are talking about the economy, world peace, or whatever. Life's good for now, and I'm not competing in a beauty pageant.

  • Decided
    Decided

    I like your post about faith. I'm going to a church with my wife. She believes in faith but it doesn't register with me. I have prayed for an enlightment from whoever God is but so far nothing has happened to convince me of anything. When I ride out in the country and see nature and the beauty of it all, I appreciate the universe but don't understand all the bad stuff that occurs in nature. Why is death so much a part of everything? Life is a mystery to me. I think religion is just a way for man to cope with death, but many times causes much death and suffering to happen to those involved in faith. I don't think I will ever understand it.

    Ken P.

  • BurnTheShips
    BurnTheShips
    That is my point BTS. How do you know? Most people's faith is tied up in proof that is not proof.

    Personal experience? It may be off limits to the objective sciences, but it is evidence to the experiencer.

    BTS

  • truthsetsonefree
    truthsetsonefree
    I don't believe that I need faith in anything at all. I simply live and enjoy life and work good toward others. I work with what I have and am not hopeless. I'm not a sinner in need of a savior, therefor, I don't need faith. I have things in my personality that need work, as we all do. Faith implies that you are expecting something and I'm not.

    My feelings as well.

    Isaac

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