Wait a minute... I thought Jesus paid for our sins.

Elsewhere

If this is true, then why do people still die at all?

cameo-d

If this is true, then why do you still face a "Judgement"?

Elsewhere: The best analogy I have heard in Western Christianity is that what Jesus did is like a person who pays your fine at traffic court, but the broken leg you got from driving too fast is the consequence of your breaking the law. Jesus paid the ultimate fine, and redeemed our souls from eternal death ... but we still suffer the consequences of sin and die in the flesh.

The Eastern Orthodox have an interesting view, and do not link legalities and payments of fines with sin. Rather, Jesus coming into this world and dying was meant to link us more with the Divine world spiritually. We still have to suffer the effects of our imperfect human existence, which we would have had to endure anyway, but now we have hope of something better in the next life, having become children of God.

I think the tragedy that the Watchtower did to JWs, and hence ex-JWs, it that they made us see Christianity like little Philadelphia lawyers, always looking for a legal angle to explain what is otherwise not fully explainable in human terms.

No wonder so many ex-JWs end up as atheists. - Jim W.

Cameo: According to most Christian denominations, once one puts faith in Jesus, and that faith is genuine in that it produces positive response to the Holy Spirit, then one no longer is concerned with judgment. In some denominations, such as Catholic and Orthodox, if one fails to response to the Holy Spirit and continues on willfully in sin, then one becomes responsible for ones sins after putting faith in Christ, and risks ultimately sinning against the Holy Spirit and losing salvation. This is not likely, but is a risk.

It is like the person whose fine was paid, but then goes out and continues to break the law and gets into accidents ... and then one day is killed in a car crash. The person who paid the fine, perhaps many times, has no reason left to save the deliberate law breaker ... because the law breaker put himself beyond help. In a similar way, we are warned in Hebrews by St. Paul that sinning willfully over time can result in being beyond the help of the price paid by Jesus. It is sobering to think about, and has worried many Christians for nearly 2,000 years.

cameo-d

Amazing: once one puts faith in Jesus,..... then one no longer is concerned with judgment.

Does WT know this?

Don't they make a platform of needing Kings (law givers) and Judges (law enforcers/penal system) in the New System?

Aren't the elders being groomed as whip masters for the New System?

snowbird

Imo, the WT has bungled dreadfully by referring to the Blood of The Lamb in dry, legalistic terms that are completely devoid of feelings.

Anyone reading the accounts of Jesus' death can see that much more was involved than simply paying a penalty for something.

It still irritates me when I read the words ransom sacrifice!

Sheesh!

Sylvia

sir82

The Eastern Orthodox have an interesting view, and do not link legalities and payments of fines with sin. Rather, Jesus coming into this world and dying was meant to link us more with the Divine world spiritually.

That is interesting, I've not seen this expressed before.

But how does "coming into the world and dying" get transmogrified into "linking us with the Dvine world spiritually"? Why would that require a death?

Amazing

Cameo: Your point is well taken ... the Watchtower leaders have truly missed the point of faith in Jesus ... for he said of himself, "I am the way, the truth, and the life" ... for he is truth, not some legalistic system of parsing words and deliberating refined rules.

Mongolia: My comments on the Orthodox are meant in that they put greater emphasis on relationship with God, and less on payment for sin. Though, even if humans had not sinned, Jesus would still have come, in the minds of Orthodox, because we still needed to be connected to God. His death was to share in everything human, to experience our joys, sadness, to share our love and suffering. God is not "required" to die or pay a price ... he chose to do it that way. It makes his love and connection to us that much more meaningful.

I affiliated for a time with the Orthodox before returning to Catholicism. I learned only a little, but it brought me back to my faith, for the Orthodox and Catholics are really the same faith. Rome does place more focus on Jesus death for our sins ... but the difference between Rome and Constantinople is not great.

WTWizard

It's all a scam. If Jesus paid for our sins, then why do we still owe Jehovah a damn thing? Why did the pre-Christ people have to make sacrifices to foreshadow the Big One? This was nothing more than a waste of time--doing something that was to be redone, perfectly, and then redoing something that has already been done perfectly. So much for "a perfect sacrifice, to which nothing ever need be added.

Notably, the same Bible that describes this "perfect sacrifice, to which nothing ever need be added" also demands that we sacrifice ourselves with "fruitage of the lips" and a "self sacrificing spirit". Those words are in the Unholy Bible itself--Paul is responsible for much of it. Of course, the Filthful and Disgraceful Slavebugger cashes in on it, making it even worse than the Unholy Bible has already. Further proof that the Bible lies--one or both of those scriptures has to be wrong.

Mall Cop

Elsewhere, and Amazing, Alan F wrote an article on God's Justice: Sin, Imperfection, and The Ransom Sacrifice. You can find it on the link "Research On The Watchtower" It is one of, if not the best response to this type of question. I found the article to be an answer that the Society or anyone else has yet to rebutt.

Blueblades still trying to have mall cop changed to Blueblades, can anyone help?

Ri

I never understood why Jesus said he would be back and we are to wait for him...over 2000 years is a little to long, isn't it?

Wait a minute... I thought Jesus paid for our sins.

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