by moomanchu 11 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Jesus accepted the Spirit's invitation to go into the desert and be tempted by Satan.
He proved his faith and proved Satan wrong.
Why don't they follow Jesus's example?
Why are they so frightened to have their faith tested?
JW's used to be always on offense when it came to debate.
They are now mostly on defense.
Because you can't prove someone who is right, wrong.
It would not be a "test of faith"....it would be showing them that the very basket they've put all of their eggs in....has a HUGE hole in the bottom of it....that is the scary part, they don't want to be told the truth.
They want to have their 'ears tickled'.
This almost seems like a silly question....lol....no offence, just thinking...you probably already knew the answer to this.
-Phee
This is exactly what led me out. And is why the leaders are so afraid of scrutiny.
Frank75
Yes, you're right I do know the answer.
The example of Jesus going to Satan to be tested by him, flys in the face of JW's who are told to avoid apostates at all costs.
I just never thought of this example before.
This would be a good point to use on JW's and their indoctrination of extraordinary fear of apostates.
Why?.....Because..It can`t be done.................The entire WBT$ belief system is based on a Tissue of Lies...........Thats why the WBT$ isolates JW`s from the outside world.....And..Forbids JW`s from meeting in groups for Bible Study,without WBT$ approval..............................................OUTLAW
People just believe what they want to believe.
That's why fairy tales/nightmares so often come "true."
I'm thinking voodoo, visitations, self-fulfilling prophecy, and most of all, "groupthink."
Groupthink is a marvelous way for groups - (including modern corporations and the individuals that follow the norms of the corporate subculture -- think Enron or Nestle during the infant formula scandals of the 80's, or perhaps even of the many genocides that have occurred thruoughout history -- yes there are other factors, but groupthink is essential to the "patriotism" or nationalistic or racist or armageddon-centered agenda/ theory) -- to justify stupid or unconscionable, amoral, and self-aggrandizing manipulation of the larger culture and of the culture within. (Yes, I know, great, big fragment upon fragment . . . stream of consciousness) . . .
JWs are experts at such self-manipulation and denial of (others') reality.
They believe, and thus create their own reality.
It is like a never-ending feedback loop, until someone caught up in it, breaks free and joins the outer world.
Then their "defection" is viewed not as a natural consequence of the human need to be free, but rather a result of supernatural, Satanic influence on the "heart" or mind of the defector.
It's very typical of groupthink for the "defector' to be castigated, outcast, fired, tortured and even destroyed from within the groupthink tank, whether the tank is a religious one or a political one. And once that pattern is established, the mind creates its own pathways to functioning and surviving within the tank. Denial of reality, facts, and/or the deeply-held "true self" is one of those multifarious mental pathways to conformity and survival in the very small, Armageddon-centered universe of the cult religion.
simple
JW's =/= Jesus
In the past Russell debated publicly some ministers.
E.L. Eaton
http://www.conservapedia.com/Charles_Taze_Russell
Lloyd Smith White
In 1943:
*** yb93 p. 102 Denmark ***Activity was especially great on the island of Amager, where a public debate was held between Jehovah’s Witnesses and clergy from the Danish national church. Two brothers, Arthur Jensen and Herløv Larsen, spoke for the Witnesses. They were skilled speakers, with quick, logical minds.
The current WTS position on debate:
*** w93 8/1 pp. 16-17 pars. 8-10 Let No One Spoil Your Useful Habits ***For example, in our witnessing work, we may encounter a person who disagrees on some point but who is willing to discuss it further. (Acts 17:32-34) That of itself need not present a problem, for we happily explain Bible truth to anyone who genuinely wants to know such, even returning to present convincing evidence. (1 Peter 3:15) Yet, some may not really be interested in finding Bible truth.
9
Many people will debate for hours, week after week, but not because they are seeking truth. They just want to undermine another’s faith while flaunting their own supposed education in Hebrew, Greek, or evolutionary science. When encountering them, some Witnesses have felt challenged and have wound up having extended association centered on false religious belief, philosophy, or scientific error. It is noteworthy that Jesus did not let that happen to him, though he could have won debates with religious leaders who were schooled in Hebrew or Greek. When challenged, Jesus replied briefly and then turned his attention again to humble ones, the real sheep.—Matthew 22:41-46; 1 Corinthians 1:23–2:2.10
Modern computers have opened other avenues to bad association. Some commercial firms enable subscribers using a computer and a telephone to send a message to electronic bulletin boards; a person can thus post on the bulletin board a message that is open to all subscribers. This has led to so-called electronic debates on religious matters. A Christian might be drawn into such debates and may spend many hours with an apostate thinker who may have been disfellowshipped from the congregation. The direction at 2 John 9-11 underscores Paul’s fatherly counsel about avoiding bad associations.
Thanks for the pertinent quotes as usual Blondie, you are a fount of knowledge.
That last one does the old mind control technique of making it seem as though Apostates have some infectious disease, "a christian might spend many hours with an Apostate thinker, (presumably this so-called christian is a Dub and therefore not a thinker of any kind) who may have been difellowshipped blah blah"
If the Dub didn't know the Thinker was DF then the Dub is innocent of going against guidelines, and spending many hours will do what exactly ? I could spend days with Witnesses,as long as I had a good supply of barf bags, and they would never convince me they had the truth, so what has a Dub to fear by debate IF he has the truth?
Love
Wobble
Why are they so frightened to have their faith tested?
I agree. I always invite JWs to my church and I will come to the KH. Never any takers.
Does darkness overcome the light or the other way round?
5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
All the best,
Stephen
