Atheist Reconsiders

by Outaservice 14 Replies latest jw friends

  • Spook
    Spook

    Hitchens is not a philosopher and probably shouldn't have debated one. Craig has been thorougly trounced himself plenty of times. Hitchens best debate IMO was against Disouza, an excellent and evenly matched style of rhetoric. Never heard of A.N. Wilson.

    Craig is a theistic populist "philosopher" and is not taken very seriously by the theistic philosophers who actually publish new academic papers. In general, most of his arguments are unsound and what he is really proving as I said earlier is that someone who has personal reasons to be a theist can be rational in rejecting naturalistic arguments. To which an atheist need only say, "piss off then, I have the personal experience of god NOT existing."

    My notre dame phd theists tell me, in no uncertain terms, he's a philosophical douchebag. I don't disagree. Avalos and Ehrman both ripped him a new one. I will credit he is a good speaker and has excellent rhetoric. His arguments are just unoriginal and long overturned.

  • PrimateDave
    PrimateDave

    Well, I read the article in question. It got tiresome when he trudged out the old complexity arguments. That's fine if you're preaching to the choir. It got really irritating when he did the "Hitler and morality" bit. Waste of time.

    Dave

  • hmike
    hmike

    Outaservice's quotes come from the Lee Strobel newsletter.

    Getting back to the original topic, Chuck Colsen has also written commentary about A. N. Wilson:

    Two decades ago, A. N. Wilson wrote a critically acclaimed biography of C.S. Lewis. This and some other of his writings led some Christians to hope that Wilson might become what Alan Jacobs once called “that figure for whom so many have been waiting for so long, The Next C. S. Lewis.”

    It therefore came as a surprise and a disappointment when Wilson publicly repudiated his Christian faith a few years later and became a mocker of Christianity.

    Yet, this past Easter, in the U.K.’s Daily Mail, Wilson was urging British Christians not be cowed by “sneering” and “self-satisfied” critics like Richard Dawkins.

    A. N. Wilson, you see, has returned to the faith. Why? In large measure because of the strongest evidence for the truth of the Gospel—that is, its impact on people’s lives.

    Wilson wrote that in his “young manhood,” he “began to wonder how much of the Easter story [he] accepted.” By his thirties, he had lost all religious belief.

    Why? He attributes it to growing up in a culture that was increasingly and “overwhelmingly secular and anti-religious.” To his “shame,” he says, he went along with the cultural tide. He felt that Christian faith was “uncool” and “unsexy.”

    Wilson didn’t stop at what he calls this “playground attitude”: he “began to rail against Christianity” and wrote a book that described Jesus as a “messianic prophet who had . . . truly failed, and died.”

    Yet on Palm Sunday just a few weeks ago, Wilson reported that he “heard the Gospel being chanted,” and could assent to it “with complete simplicity.” Sometime in the past five years, he went from writing a book about a failed messianic prophet to believing that Jesus had risen from the dead.

    Again, the question is “why?” Part of the reason was that atheism and atheists in his words, “[miss] out on some very basic experiences of life.” He described listening to Bach or reading the works of Christian authors and realizing that their “perception of life was deeper, wiser, more rounded than [his] own.” seeing the world through the eyes of faith is “much more interesting” he said, than the alternatives.

    Then there was the low esteem in which Darwinism holds man. The people who insist that we are “simply anthropoid apes” can’t account for something as basic as language. The “existence of language,” love and music, to name but a few, convinced Wilson that we are “spiritual beings.” For Wilson, they prove that “the religion of the incarnation, asserting that God made humanity in His image, and continually restores humanity in His image, is simply true.”

    Then there’s what he regards the “an even stronger argument”: “the way that Christian faith transforms individual lives.” From “Bonhoeffer’s serenity before he was hanged” to the person next to you at church, Christians bear witness to the truth of Christianity and that as a “working blueprint for life” and “template against which to measure experience, it fits.”

    (From the crosswalk website, http://www.crosswalk.com/news/commentary/11603062/ )

    Both theist and atheist communities like to bring their converts to the forefront. The stories are always interesting, this one perhaps more so because he is a double-convert, or a re-convert.

  • Psychotic Parrot
    Psychotic Parrot

    I can understand how someone with a limited understanding of cosmology (most of us really) may conclude that there needs to be some sort of creator (although i don't make that conclusion myself), but jumping straight for Jesus because you feel life is mysterious = dumbass move.

  • rebel8
    rebel8

    What PrimateDave was referring to:

    I haven’t mentioned morality, but one thing that finally put the tin hat on any aspirations to be an unbeliever was writing a book about the Wagner family and Nazi Germany, and realising how utterly incoherent were Hitler’s neo-Darwinian ravings, and how potent was the opposition, much of it from Christians; paid for, not with clear intellectual victory, but in blood. Read Pastor Bonhoeffer’s book Ethics, and ask yourself what sort of mad world is created by those who think that ethics are a purely human construct.

    Hitler looooved religion. He incorporated rituals and symbols from many religions into Nazism because he knew the voodoo that it could do to you. :D

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