I think this would be more successful in a country like France or the UK.
Class action suit for pain, suffering & discrimination
by lettib74 55 Replies latest jw friends
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sammielee24
I think we cannot underestimate the power of those against the society inside the USA. Your first black president was elected, the country is changing and if one never tries, one will never know what might be accomplished.
The bigger issue is the number of xjw's that still hold on to some small bit of crap that is the society..either their family is inside, or they say they don't care, or they refuse to accept or acknowledge that they haven't gotten over a life of doctrinal mindset. Many xjw's still refuse to speak badly of the organization and many more insist it's okay because they aren't being shunned - yet - or they don't want to make waves, or they haven't known anyone personally whose been the victim of child molestation, or a JC on rape, spousal abuse, suicide, blood doctrine or disfellowshipping and shunning. As long as it doesn't make them cry at night it's okay on some small level. Kind of like the Catholic church on child abuse - a lot knew but it was okay as long as it didn't touch them. Kind of like someone committing suicide - if it wasn't your mother, or your sister who killed themselves and you saw when it started and you knew the why's, it won't affect you - you can pretend to ignore all that bad stuff cos it hasn't hit your heart yet. The power the society has is not in their current members - it rests with the large ex-JW community that in some strange way does little to force change in the very organization that is the very reason they spend time on this board and so many like them. sammieswife.
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Homerovah the Almighty
The power the society has is not in their current members - it rests with the large ex-JW community that in some strange way does little to force change in the very organization that is the very reason they spend time on this board and so many like them.
Totally agree Sammielee24, there are a number of reasons why little action is taken against this enormous unjust kingdom,
mostly its the power that money brings. Most people aren't financially capable to fight this rich giant of a corporation in the courts,
the WTS on the other hand do have the finances to put up a strong fight in the courts to maintain themselves. There is also the
preponderance of power and fear that this organization has created for itself and set in the minds of anyone who gets close or
involved with them. When they say this is god's one and only solemn organization they mean don't mess with us or we will strike
you down with vengeance just like the hand of god. We all know how vengeful Jehovah is to those who do not obey him and
bow down to his will and purpose. Real shit happens when individual men grab on to this almighty of powers.
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garybuss
In the United States a suit against the Watch Tower Corporation would be, most likely, dismissed in summary judgement as frivolous and harassing. The plaintiff would receive a HUGE bill for the defendant's legal costs.
If the case got to court I'd side with the Watch Tower because I don't want the shunning policy changed, no way, no how! Witness shunning is the best thing that's ever happened to me. -
Homerovah the Almighty
In my opinion the JWS directly running on their own laws by design have broken the law regarding a persons liberties for freedom of choice of religion, inciting pain, suffering and discrimination.
I think you missed my point Jack, what I was referring to is how the JWS act and treat individuals if they choose to leave and go to another religion.
Publicly announcing that a certain individual is not one of the JWS any longer and making it clear that anyone who wants
to remain in good standing with this organization is to not associate with this individual, is inciting discrimination against that individual who is making a
different religious choice. The legal definition of discrimination also includes the choice of religion along with race and sexual identity .
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cameo-d
What about a fraud suit on behalf of the millions who were living that died anyway?
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sammielee24
Please the JW's come close to criminal negilgence when it comes to minors but pass that we are talking about grown adults making their own choices
Minors who are manipulated into baptism become grown adults who despite what you say, are often trapped by a child's decision and ill prepared to understand the consequences. Talk about 'free will' is just that - talk. There is little 'free will' when raised in a group that controls all aspects of your behavior from how you dress, what education you will get, what activities you will engage in, what music you listen to or books you read. There is little 'free will' when it comes to social interaction or association with the world. That's why it's called a cult - a high control group. That's why people raised in it have more problems in coping - when a persons life is controlled they most often suffer from social retardation. A cult and high control group breathes fear and guilt into it's membership in order to control - a little kid who is raised on fear of abandonment by his entire family and by God - is little different than the little molested kid who is raised on fear of abandonment by his entire family if he speaks up. Fear is a terrific motivator to keep one in line and thus end any suggestion and at some point, any desire to seek that 'free will'.
That's why you have abuse victims who wait for 50 years to come forward - fear and control. Free will exists in pretty speeches but has little to do with the reality for many people around the world who live in some extreme circumstances. Free will is allowed only as far as the parameters you live in will let you use - the tighter the control, the less you will understand that you actually have such a thing. Do prisoners have free will? Do victims of war have free will? Did Hutu's have free will? Did Russians under Stalin have free will? Did choir boys in the Catholic church have free will? Free will is really an out for anyone who chooses to ignore the massive trauma caused by abusers and who chooses to remain ignorant of the challenges, inability and slow growth of those who eventually get out of a bad situation..and a lack of compassion and interest in the reason so many stay. Just my take..sammieswife.
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sammielee24
Whatever your childhood is the law holds you responsible for your decisions once you become an adult.
But respectfully, I don't think you are understanding the point that for many, many people raised in the organization, they do not have the tools necessary to make decisions that would enable them to leave a cult. That is an inarguable fact that can be found in any mediocre review on psychology. People grow up and make decisions for their lives based in large part as a result of the actions toward them as a child. Many children who are abused (and I use the comparison because control by fear, manipulation and punishment are the same mechanisms) find it extremely difficult and some find it impossible, to escape the imagery and mental/emotional distress that comes from such a household. To say that as an adult just because you are abused you cannot in turn go ahead and kill someone is correct since that is against the law; to say that as an adult you should magically just put abuse behind you and be tough and walk away, forgive and move on, is not possible for many people. Lives are linked to the past in hopes of a better future. A person who does not have a comparator from which to move forward, usually remains locked in the abusive mindset sometimes forever. A high control group that monitors and punishes any activity outside that group, leaves many children moving in adulthood without the coping skills, the faith, the belief, even the curiosity to delve into the world and as such, that organization has in fact acted in such a way as to retard the individual in negative ways for generations. Realistically, abused children in the 'world' have a better chance of improving since their association is not limited to approved relations inside the same organization that they are victims of. In addtion, why must a victim walk away from his/her abuser while the perpetrator continues to abuse? That makes no sense which is why an adult can go after an abuser who offended as a child and who may still be abusing other children and in fact, may be abusing adults. An adult inside a religion, is equally responsible for their actions as is the person who in turn acts out based on the information given.
I never stayed angry at the Society, they were just a bunch of cooks. But I did and still do hold my parents responsible for CHOOSING to shove that crap down my throat as a matter of fact not faith.
A lot of people are not angry with their parents and have taken up the issue with them, however, a parent would not have shoved the crap down your throat as fact if they had not been themselves, told many of those things are fact.
Under freedom of religion the WTBS teachings are represented as a matter of faith.
I disagree. The WTS teachings are presented as fact. Not faith. 1975 was presented as fact. Armageddon was given a specific time - and people acted accordingly. The WTS presents worldly people as satanistic, as drunkards, sluts and unworthy. Those are presented as fact - I've sat through the meetings and heard the speaker tell the flock that any association would put them in liege with harlots and drunkards. The WTS presented as fact that millions now living would never die - a major reason why many joined the organization, why the raised their kids in it, why they did not save for retirement, why they moved to where the need was greater and so on. The WTS presents their NEW LIGHT as a fact - and then punish you if you disagree with the new fact. They revamp their bible and use it as the basis for their 'faith' and then punish anyone who dares compare it to another publication because their bible is presented as fact. It is the 'truth'. If what they teach is the 'truth' then the premise is that everything else is a lie and from that perspective, they are presenting all as fact.
You can't jail someone because of thoughts, action is required.
Exactly. The WTS acts every time they knock on a door. Every time they promise that you will never die. Every time they promise that your children will never die. Every time they disfellowship. Every time they tell children that they will need not go to school because they will never die or have need of an education. They are acting every time they tell the flock to turn their backs on their family. Those are actions the WTS takes..reference upon reference in their own material proves that. Action is theocratic warfare in child custody cases. Action is taking a kid from a hospital to avoid treatment. New Light is the legal way of a shadow religion hopes to absolve themselves of past facts and of destructive actions. Sometimes the cost to society must be weighed against the destructive tentacles of any cult and any shadow religion..did people deserve to die as witches? Did people deserve to be tortured because they were Protestant or Catholic? Did or do women deserve to be beaten or stoned to death because they are fundamental muslims? Humans are complex beings and sometimes circumstance and environment create adults who don't take what others see as equal opportunity to disengage..that's why we put laws in place to protect the weaker. The WTS has acted in ways that are destructive, illogical and tragic for thousands upoin thousands of people, they have made factual statements on the basis of 'belief' and then changed those facts and beliefs once they coerced people into joining and then enacted punishment if one didn't go along.
Finally, we need to understand what a religion is and what a cult is. If you believe that the WTS is a religion than you believe it's acting under those beliefs...if you believe it is a cult, then are the rules different? sammieswife.
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Elsewhere
Here are a few legal points for you to bring up with your lawyer:
1. The WTS will say that they are not the ones who are causing you pain.
2. The WTS will say that they did not cause people to shun you... shunning you was the choice of the individuals who did shun you.For your lawsuit to be successful your lawyer will need to prove to the court that the WTS compelled the JWs to shun you.
3. The WTS will claim "protection under the 1st Amendment of religious freedom".
This is where your lawyer will need to get creative. Your lawyer will need to find a way to convince the court that shunning causes so much pain and suffering that it is not protected by the 1st amendment. The argument will need to be something like the argument that yelling "fire" in a crowded auditorium, or slander is not protected free speech under the 1st Amendment.
If your lawyer can pull this off, it will be a revolutionary court finding that will remove many barriers that have been protecting the abusive behavior of many religions... not just the WTS.
Make sure your lawyer does his research, otherwise he'll be blindsided by the brutal efficiency of the WTS's lawyers in court. They have over 100 years experience manipulating the law and the courts to their advantage.
I recommend your lawyer consult with other lawyers who have dealt with the WTS so as to gain valuable insight as to how to approach the situation. A good start would be the lawyers who took the WTS to court regarding child molestation.