by New day 64 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
When you read Ray Franz book you come to notice that going in, mind control is far from ones mind when become governing body member because you are already program to the illustional ways of the WTBS.
the eyes of reality becomes in focus when the first seed of doubt happens! Then your life change calling for a mental altering life decision.
when WTBS cannot apologize for errors, blaming others even individuals that demonstrate "thought" control in the publications needs to be administered.
Ray Franz did not write all of the WT output, or anything near it, when he was on the G.B
One would need to know which articles he wrote, and examine them, to see if there were any Mind Control techniques in use by him, which I doubt.
He may have subliminally absorbed some minor methods, it's true, perhaps using some of their favourite ones like "honest-hearted ones ......." etc but what I am talking about, when I accuse them of lying is far more blatant than that.
When thy mis-quote completely, as in the "Trinity" Brochure, and countless Watchtower articles, of course they know they are lying.
Ray Franz and I had some very interesting conversations, in which he tried to help me on my way, his love and total honesty were natural parts of his personality, I cannot see him ever as being happy with subterfuge and half-truth even, let alone downright lying.
Finkelstein, I remember reading Hassan's book and getting to that section and the list of techniques you have posted (pg 3 of this string) and having a "WOW" moment. Another level of awakening. IMO, you've left off the highlighting of several other things that clearly apply to the JW methods.
Doc
This is an interesting question with thoughtful replies.
Hassan’s criteria for mind control, certainly fits the pattern for the method deployed by JW leadership. But I find it hard to imagine that they believe they are practicing some devious dark psychological art themselves. I would suggest that they are using a method of emotional abuse in the way that an unkind and thoughtless parent wants to control a child. For example by threats, fears and guilt. It is a kind of ’grooming’ by the governing body for the purpose of compliance to their will. The GB members are the greatest beneficiaries of the continued financial success of the cult and therefore they exploit the flock to this end.
What Hassan has done is analyse the nuts and bolts of how it is done and his model works for all people or groups invested with some authority over others who abuse that power, not that they consciously think they are using “mind control”.
Phizzy-When thy mis-quote completely, as in the "Trinity" Brochure, and countless Watchtower articles, of course they know they are lying.
Ray Franz and I had some very interesting conversations, in which he tried to help me on my way, his love and total honesty were natural parts of his personality, I cannot see him ever as being happy with subterfuge and half-truth even, let alone downright lying.
I would certainly agree that they know they are lying when they purposely misquote, misrepresent, etc. That is still not deliberate mind control in of itself. We need to remember that these guys believe they are the closest thing to god on earth. If they believe that hubris, they can justify any deception, misrepresentation, or even outright lies in the name of the "greater good", whatever that may be from their perspective. Hell, they have managed to manipulate themselves this way.
I have talked to Ray myself, and agree he was an honest man. However, I would argue that he would even say he was not truly exceptional. Ray was forced to resign. He continued to go to JW meetings in Alabama. He remained a JW until he was dis-fellowshipped a year and a half later. My point here is that something made him "wake up", but it was not obvious until he was completely out. It is unfair and inaccurate to state that others in leadership positions are not equally as blinded. They are indeed blinded by their own hubris. That IS the problem.
d4g
To greater or lesser degree what religious institution does not use and imply mind control ?
If applying mind control to create a semblance of power and control over people, then mind control obviously has its
self sustaining advantages.
Mind control is Jehovah, Allah and Buddha approved.
I don't disagree that "they are blinded by their own hubris" Done4Good, and that is the root of the problem too, you are right.
But the question was, do they know what they are doing, or is it just a sort of unconscious thing.
You cannot use the methods that they do without knowing what you are doing.
Mitigation may be claimed (by them) by what you say blinds them as to the moral position, but they have to know what they are doing, or they simply could not actually do it.
Mind control is another name for parental conditioning because in general a child is raised in the tradition of their parent(s). They are told what to believe and since as a young child they do not have the mental capacity to oppose it............. you accept it on some level.
I was raised a Catholic and at a certain age I was handed over to a nun who prepared us for communion. So my parents religion now had an authority figure who presented some of the doctrines, and disciplines of the church. All of this was wrapped around a Mass which was a weekly ceremony and one that had it's rituals down pat.
In a religious or believing household it's a three step process. You are exposed to religious beliefs as a very young child then you are exposed to an authority figure who instructs through a holy book of some sort. Eventually you are assimilated into some form of religion, church etc. In general you may change your mind but you self change your tradition
If you were unlucky enough to be born into a high control JW construct you may never see your way clear. You will have had a lot of hard wiring to get rid of hence the stress that many can not handle.
I find it telling that though we have strayed somewhat in this Thread toward what level of consciousness is involved in the Mind Control, we are agreed that it is certainly practiced.
This is a little like arguing about whether a Car Salesman really believes in his product, or he is using his sales methods in a purely cynical way to earn his commission. We agree he is using the techniques of the sales person.
My argument with the WT/JW religion and its undoubted use of mind control techniques is this :
If they had the Truth there would simply be no need to use such methods at all.
