is it hysteria?

by stillin 20 Replies latest watchtower scandals

• 

  stillin

  this child-abuse thing. Disgusting? Yes. More prevalent than ever? Probably widespread. Does carrying a bagful of Watchtowers and Awakes help identify a child molester? Gimme a break, it should be so simple. Is this a feeding frenzy fuelled by the media and our own emotions and natural inclinations to protect our kids? I think it is. I think a lot of the folks who post here paint a delicate scene with too broad a brush.

  I would respectfully submit that the percentage of deviants in the org. is only slightly higher than in the general population, and that only because the new, stricter guidelines for elders are only recently taking effect, thanks to the almighty, monetary consequences of their previous negligence.

  To those who have had thier bad experiences within the WT, my full sympathy and support.
• 

  OUTLAW

  Nothing has changed in the WBT$..

  For some..

  The pedophile issue needs to be explained to them with a Baseball Bat..

  ...........................OUTLAW
• 

  blondie

  So stillin, why do you think your limited input from media and local stories gives you the data to have an accurate picture? Have you checked law enforcement stats? I think not.
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  stillin

  blondie, you're right, I have no hard numbers on the subject, only my own observations. But anybody can see how manipulated John Q Public is by the media, and that's my point. Everybody jumps on the bandwagon for a righteous cause...and it IS righteous, but is the noise in proportion or is it just another media feeding frenzy, coupled with an opportunity to see the WT in the worst possible light, the obvious agenda of many here?

  The figures don't lie, but liars can figure...
• 

  littlebird

  Hello stillin,

  The issue isn't how many molesters there are within Jehovahs Witnesses, but rather the policies that the WT institutes that protect the molester and leave the children vulnerable.

  1. The 2 witness rule. Molesters don't usually have an audience.

  2. Only reporting accusations in states that require them to report.

  3. If you, as a victim, cannot prove your charge, you can be reproved or disfellowshipped for lying and if you speak of it to others, you will be punished for causing divisions. I know of 2 cases personally.

  4. Since the accusation is kept quiet, other members, who are not elders, are left unaware that there is a molester is amongst them.

  These are just of few of the problems. You can visit silentlambs.org for more info.
• 

  stillin

  If I surface years after I was molested, and I've finally gotten the courage up to face my attacker, never having utterred a word to anybody before, isn't that simply one person's word against another's? Yet, I will have succeeded in royally messing up somebody's life, perhaps like they have royally messed up mine. The "two witnesses" thing has its' place, and civil suits have thiers. Sometimes throwing a case out of court is the best thing a judge can do.

  Is it impossible that anybody will ever point their finger at YOU?

  Is there any such thing as a Jehovahs Witness being wrongly accused? Or is this a kangaroo court?
• 

  jamiebowers

  If I surface years after I was molested, and I've finally gotten the courage up to face my attacker, never having utterred a word to anybody before, isn't that simply one person's word against another's? Yet, I will have succeeded in royally messing up somebody's life, perhaps like they have royally messed up mine. The "two witnesses" thing has its' place, and civil suits have thiers. Sometimes throwing a case out of court is the best thing a judge can do.

  You are not correctly stating the problem. ALL of the abuse survivors in the news did speak up and were ignored at best and threatened with df'ing at worst. The two witness rule does not have a place when it comes to child molestation. What kind of person would insist on a child having witnesses to abuse that's carried on in secret?

  Is there any such thing as a Jehovahs Witness being wrongly accused? Or is this a kangaroo court?

  I can't think of anything being closer to a kangaroo court than men who are untrained in law enforcement and psychology trying to determine whether or not a child has been molested. Put such situations into the capable hands of the authorities, and both sides will be represented. Leaving it in the hands of the elders under the direction of te WB&TS, only the pedophile is represented.

  All of that being said, I hope you or your children never have to face such cruelty and injustice as have the WB&TS abuse survivors.
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  choosing life

  All accusers should be free to report the charge of sexual abuse to the authorities. It is a crime and needs to be investigated. The courts are not perfect, but they are the best judicial system we have.

  The witnesses try to circumvent the police and the court system, thereby protecting the molesters.

  Do you really support this?
• 

  stillin

  no, I do not suggest that the two-witness deal is the decisive factor for elders. It seems that the mere SUGGESTION of two VICTIMS would warrant serious inquiry, and notification of proper authorities. But an accusation from out of nowhere, while serious, shouldn't serve to ruin a person's life!

  And I certainly agree with jamiebowers that elders aren't qualified to determine anything! They have thier own game plan and will believe what they WANT to believe. I just hate seeing the same thing here.
• 

  littlebird

  Yes, stillin, I do believe someone could be wrongly accused. However, the protection of children should be the top priority. Other individuals have to report an accusation whether or not someones life is ruined, teachers, daycare providers, doctors and yes, clergy.

  Many witnesses don't go to the police because of the reasons I've already stated, and also because they don't wish to take a brother to court, they are fearful of bringing reproach on Jehovah's name. Im not saying I agree with it, because I dont, I've just seen it happen.

  It is not up to the elders to judge whether a person is guilty of child molesting, but it is also not their job to decide that a child is lying either. Thats what our legal system is for. If people would just take their children to the police, instead of the elders, I believe that would be the best first step. If the news got around the hall, the elders could just tell others to let the legal system do it's job, then parents would be able to make their own decision as to whether or not they want their children around the accused. The way it is now, the parents have no clue. They have trust in the leaders of the congregation to protect them and several times these acts of abuse have been committed by elders and servants who were known to be molesters by the WT. Did you know that when we were distributing kingdom news 37, that condemned the catholic church for their child abuse cases, the WT was settling cases of their own? It was hypocrisy at its finest.

  Suppose your child came to you about brother/sister so & so. They were molested. Maybe at another witnesses house, out in service, at the hall, wherever. You're upset, confused, distraught, and you go to the presiding overseer for advise, "What do I do?"

  The elders will question your child. They call the legal dept. If you are in a reporting state, great! If you are not, oops. Depending on who your body of elders are will depend on the advice you get.

  They will confront the accused. If that person denies it, this is what you could be told. You could be told that "We can't tell you what to do, but, if you do tell anyone, you could bring reproach on Jehovah's name and ruin brother/sister so & so's life . If you didn't see it, and there's no witnesses, how do you know your child is telling the truth? You could be slandering this person and cause divisions in the congregation. In these situations you just have to wait on Jehovah. Right now everything just between your family and the body of elders, that's where it needs to stay or we'll have to take action against someone, if we cant prove brother/sister so & so did this, you could be counselled and possibly disiplined for slander. "

  So my friend, you have two choices as a parent. You can believe your child and take the chance of ruining someone's life and go to the police, knowing without "two witnesses" you could be disfellowshipped for slander. Or you can shut up and risk ruining your childs life and possibly other childrens lives. It's up to you.