by frankiespeakin 33 Replies latest watchtower bible
Rare? Where is your evidence for this claim that it's rare from someone to go from disbelief to belief? And why would the reasons need to be complicated?
Does parental influence or parental atheistic programming affect children, causing them to become adults who don't believe in God?
Hey Pass I don't have any evidence to share with you on what I'm saying,(this is not a science paper or anything) belief in god main cause is infant indoctrination,,so I'm approaching it from that perspective, so the word rarity is relative to this understanding, not like the term used to mean 1 in a million type of rarity.
So you're admitting you don't have any proof or evidence to back up the claims;
- it's rare for someone to go from being an atheist to believing in God
- belief in God stems from infant indoctrination
But without such proof, how can we believe what you're saying without faith?
You got me on the faith thing very clever. I don't have time to do the research it's not high priority on my things to do list and so faith is a time saver too in this case. And so I make a case for faith being a result of no evidence and a time factor of research and ones priorities in life and so faith may mainly be a time saver for some who don't have time to do the math so to speak.
Here's a good example of someone who went from atheism to faith;
Francis Collins.
From Wikipedia;
Collins has described his parents as "only nominally Christian" and by graduate school he considered himself an atheist. However, dealing with dying patients led him to question his religious views, and he investigated various faiths. He familiarized himself with the evidences for and against God in cosmology, and used Mere Christianity by C. S. Lewis [ 13 ] as a foundation to re-examine his religious view. He eventually came to a theistic conclusion, and finally became an evangelical Christian during a hike on a fall afternoon.
In his 2006 book The Language of God: A Scientist Presents Evidence for Belief, Collins considers scientific discoveries an "opportunity to worship." In his book Collins examines and subsequently rejects creationism and intelligent design. His own belief system is theistic evolution which he prefers to term BioLogos.
In an interview with National Geographic published in February 2007, interviewer John Horgan, an agnostic journalist, criticized Collins' description of agnosticism as "a cop-out". In response, Collins clarified his position on agnosticism so as not to include "earnest agnostics who have considered the evidence and still don't find an answer. I was reacting to the agnosticism I see in the scientific community, which has not been arrived at by a careful examination of the evidence. I went through a phase when I was a casual agnostic, and I am perhaps too quick to assume that others have no more depth than I did." [ 14 ]
During a debate with the biologist Richard Dawkins, Collins stated that God is the explanation of those features of the universe that science finds difficult to explain (such as the values of certainphysical constants favoring life), and that God himself does not need an explanation since he is beyond the universe. Dawkins called this "the mother and father of all cop-outs" and "an incredible evasion of the responsibility to explain", to which Collins responded "I do object to the assumption that anything that might be outside of nature is ruled out of the conversation. That's an impoverished view of the kinds of questions we humans can ask, such as 'Why am I here?', 'What happens after we die?' If you refuse to acknowledge their appropriateness, you end up with a zero probability of God after examining the natural world because it doesn't convince you on a proof basis. But if your mind is open about whether God might exist, you can point to aspects of the universe that are consistent with that conclusion." [ 15 ]
In reviewing The Dawkins Delusion?: Atheist Fundamentalism and the Denial of the Divine by Alister McGrath [ 16 ] , Collins says "Addressing the conclusions of The God Delusion point by point with the devastating insight of a molecular biologist turned theologian, Alister McGrath dismantles the argument that science should lead to atheism, and demonstrates instead that Dawkins has abandoned his much-cherished rationality to embrace an embittered manifesto of dogmatic atheist fundamentalism.", [ 17 ] [citation needed]
Collins remains firm in his rejection of intelligent design, and for this reason was not asked to participate in the 2008 documentary Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed, which tries, among other things, to draw a direct link between evolution and atheism. Walt Ruloff, a producer for the film, claimed that Collins was "toeing the party line" by rejecting intelligent design, which Collins called "just ludicrous." [ 18 ]
In 2009, Collins founded the BioLogos Foundation to "contribute to the public voice that represents the harmony of science and faith." He served as the foundation's president until he was confirmed as director of the NIH. [ 19 ]
Frankie: "God too has to go in time, eventually, just like not all at once and for everybody. Religion to control the mind is on a head on course with human species vastly excellerated enlightenment"
Here's the plan: (attributed to Albert Pike)
"We shall unleash the Nihilists and the Atheists and we shall provoke a formidable social cataclysm which, in all its horror will show clearly to the nations the effect of absolute atheism, the origin of savagery and of the most bloody turmoil. Then everywhere, the citizens, forced to defend themselves against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, disillusioned with Christianity, whose deistic spirits will form direction and leadership, anxious for an ideal, but without knowledge where to render its adoration, will receive the pure light through the universal manifestation of the pure doctrine of Lucifer, brought finally out into public view, a manifestation which will result from a general reactionary movement which will follow the destruction of Christianity and atheism, both conquered and exterminated at the same time."...
What cameo-d said.
Pass,
You said:
Rare? Where is your evidence for this claim that it's rare from someone to go from disbelief to belief? And why would the reasons need to be complicated?
Does parental influence or parental atheistic programming affect children, causing them to become adults who don't believe in God?
And then you post something that is completely different and doesn't even match what your trying to prove.
Cam,
I don't understand heads or tails of what he's saying.
This is the same type of "if" "then" reasoning the WTBTS uses, IMO. I don't think one has to necessarily follow the other. For example, if all stop signs are red, and apples are red, then all signs must be apples. huh? makes just about as much sense.
Ada
