JW Chain E-mail about Jeapardy stating NWT

by skeeter1 10 Replies latest jw friends

  • skeeter1
    skeeter1

    Here's a load of horse shit.

    *************************************

    Print it and keep it for a reference in the field ministry.

    Recently on Jeopardy, one of the answers was "It's the most accurate translation of the Holy Scriptures?" No one got the correct question, soAlex Trebek said "What is the; New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures , printed by the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society ."

    Book: " TRUTH IN TRANSLATION: ACCURACY AND BIAS IN ENGLISH TRANSLATIONS OF THE NEW TESTAMENT " Author: Jason David BeDuhn is the Associate Professor of Religious Studies at Northern Arizona University in Flagstaff. He holds a B.A. In Religious Studies from the University of Illinois, Urbana, an M.T.S. In New Testament and Christian Origins from Harvard Divinity School , and a Ph.D. In Comparative Study of Religions form Indiana University, Bloomington The Nine English Translations Compared in BeDuhn's book are: - The King James Version (KJV) - The Amplified Bible (AB) - The Living Bible (LB) - The New American Bible (NAB) - The New American Standard Bible (NASB) - The New International Version (NIV) - The New World Translation (NW) - The (New) Revised Standard Version (NRSV) - Today's English Version (TEV) EXCERPTS FROM HIS BOOK: Chapter Four: Examples of translation of the Greek word "proskuneo", used 58 times in the New Testament. The word is translated various ways as worship, do obeisance, fall down on one's knees, bow before. Scriptures discussed include Matt. 18:26 ; Rev. 3:9; Mark 15:18 ,19; Matt 2:1, 2, 8,11; Matt 14:33 ; Matt 28:9, "... In our exploration of this issue, we can see how theological bias has been the determining context for the choices made by all of the translations except the NAB and NW... Translators seem to feel the need to add to the New Testament support for the idea that Jesus was recognized to be God." Regarding Matt. 28:16, 17, where all versions except the NW use "worship" where the NW uses "did obeisance": "Here all translations except the NW have recourse to "worship" -- a rendering which makes no sense in this context... This contradiction seems to be missed by all the translators except those who prepared the NW." Chapter Five: A discussion of Philippians 2:5-11: "The NW translators... Have understood "harpagmos" accurately as grasping at something one does not have, that is, a "seizure." The literary context supports the NW translation (and refutes the KJV's "thought it not robbery to be equal)..." Chapter Seven: A discussion on Col. 1: 15-20: "It is a tricky passage where every translation must add words." "The LB translator is guilty of all the doctrinal importation discussed above with reference to the NIV, NRSV, and TEV, and even surpasses them in this respect. So it is the NIV, NRSV, TEV and LB -- the four Bibles that make no attempt to mark added words - that actually add the most significant tendentious material. Yet in many public forums on Bible translation , the practice of these four translations is rarely if ever pointed to or criticized, while the NW is attacked for adding the innocuous "other" in a way that clearly indicates its character as an addition of the translators... But the NW is correct. "Other" is implied in "all", and the NW simply makes what is implicit explicit... It is ironic that the translation of Col.. 1:15-20 that has received the most criticism is the one where the "added words" are fully justified by what is implied in the Greek." Chapter Eight : A discussion on Titus 2:13; 2 Thess. 1:12; 2 Peter 1:1, 2: "... The position of those who insist "God" and "Savior" must refer to the same being... Is decidedly weakened." Chapter Nine: A discussion of Hebrews 8:1: "so we must conclude that the more probable translation is "God is your throne..., "the translation found in the NW.... It seems likely that it is only because most translations were made by people who already believe that Jesus is God that the less probable way of translating this verse has been preferred." Chapter Ten: A discussion on John 8:58 : "Both the LB and the NW offer translations that coordinate the two verbs in John 8:58 according to proper English syntax, and that accurately reflect the meaning of the Greek idiom. The other translations fail to do this." "There is absolutely nothing in the original Greek of John 8:58 to suggest that Jesus is quoting the Old Testament here, contrary to what the TEV tries to suggest by putting quotations marks around "I am." "The majority of translations recognize these idiomatic uses of "I am", and properly integrate the words into the context of the passages where they appear. Yet when it comes to 8:58, they suddenly forget how to translate." "All the translations except theLB and NW also ignore the true relation between the verbs of the sentence and produce a sentence that makes no sense in English. These changes in the meaning of the Greek and in the normal procedure for translation point to a bias that has interfered with the work of the translators." "No one listening to Jesus, and no one reading John in his own time would have picked up on a divine self-identification in the mere expression "I am," which, if you think about, is just about the most common pronoun-verb combination in any language." "The NW... understands the relation between the two verbs correctly... The average Bible reader might never guess that there was something wrong with the other translations, and might even assume that the error was to be found in the... NW." Chapter Eleven: A discussion of John 1:1: "Surprisingly, only one, the NW, adheres to the literal meaning of the Greek, and translates "a god." "Translators of the KJV, NRSV, NIV, NAB, NASB , AB , TEV and LB all approached the text at John 1:1 already believing certain things about the Word... and made sure that the translations came out in accordance with their beliefs. ... Ironically, some of these same scholars are quick to charge the NW translation with "doctrinal bias" for translating the verse literally, free of KJV influence, following the sense of the Greek. It may very well be that the NW translators came to the task of translating John 1:1 with as much bias as the other translators did. It just so happens that their bias corresponds in this case to a more accurate translation of the Greek" "Some early Christians maintained their monotheism by believing that the one God simply took on a human form and came to earth -- in effect, God the Father was born and crucified as Jesus. They are entitled to their belief, but it cannot be derived legitimately from the Gospel according to John ." "John himself has not formulated a Trinity concept in his Gospel." "All that we can ask is that a translation be an accurate starting point for exposition and interpretation. Only the NW achieves that, as provocative as it sounds to the modern reader.. The other translations cut off the exploration of the verse's meaning before it has even begun." Chapter Twelve: A discussion of holy spirit: "In Chapter Twelve, no translation emerged with a perfectly consistent and accurate handling of the many uses and nuances of "spirit" and "holy spirit." The NW scored highest in using correct impersonal forms of the relative and demonstrative pronouns consistently with the neuter noun "holy spirit," and in adhering to the indefinite expression "holy spirit" in those few instances when it was used by the Biblical authors ." Summary:"...it can be said that the NW emerges as the most accurate of the translations compared...the translators managed to produce works relatively more accurate and less biased than the translations produced by multi-denominational teams, as well as those produced by single individuals." " Jehovah's Witnesses ... really sought to reinvent Christianity from scratch... building their system of belief and practice from the raw material of the Bible without predetermining what was to be found there. Some critics, of course, would say that the results of this practice can be naive. But for Bible translation, at least, it has meant a fresh approach to the text, with far less presumption than that found in may of the Protestant translations." "...Most of the differences are due to the greater accuracy of the NW as a literal, conservative translation of the original expressions of the New Testament." Commenting on bias in translation : "To me, it expresses a lack of courage, a fear that the Bible does not back up their "truth" enough. To let the Bible have its say, regardless of how well or poorly that say conforms to expectations or accepted forms of modern Christianity is an exercise in courage or, to use another word for it, faith." For those that want to add this book to their library, it's available on www.Amazon.com:

  • skeeter1
    skeeter1

    A Jeapardy question, really?

    Well, every Jeapardy question ever asked is on the Internet. There is no "New World Translation" question. But, I did find a few Watchtower questions. They were about the group's identity.

    http://www.j-archive.com/listseasons.php

    Jeopardy! Round, Double Jeopardy! Round, or Tiebreaker Round clues (10 results returned)

    #5558, aired 2008-11-05"G" WHIZ $1000: From the Old French for "watchtower", it's an attic room that's perfect for a soulful starving artist garret
    #5492, aired 2008-06-24COVER YOUR TRACKS $200: Jimi Hendrix electrified fans with "All Along The Watchtower" , written by this folksy guy Bob Dylan
    #5260, aired 2007-06-22"H"E MAN $400: "All Along The Watchtower" was this guitar virtuoso's only Billboard Top 40 hit Jimi Hendrix
    #4780, aired 2005-05-20GRAND CANYON NATIONAL PARK $2000: Using pueblos as a model, Mary Colter designed the structure seen here, known by this 10-letter name the Watchtower
    #4721, aired 2005-02-28THE JIMMY CARTER EXPERIENCE $1000: Based in this city, the Carter Center is "All Along the Watchtower" against disease & famine Atlanta
    #4340, aired 2003-06-13KEEP THE FAITH $600: Their magazine is called "The Watchtower" & their churches are called Kingdom Halls Jehovah's Witnesses
    #3565, aired 2000-02-18BEFORE & AFTER $500: A Watchtower distributor's relocation service provided by U.S. marshals Jehovah's Witness Protection Program
    #2813, aired 1996-11-20AROUND THE HOUSE $500: From Old French for watchtower, it's a room under a sloping roof, often rented by starving artists Garret
    #2128, aired 1993-12-01RELIGION $200: This group's corporate bodies are the Watchtower Bible & Tract Societies of PA & NY Jehovah's Witnesses
    #5, aired 1984-09-14RELIGION $200: More common name for The Watchtower Bible & Tract Society Jehovah's
  • skeeter1
    skeeter1

    Regarding Jason David BeDuhn's book...

    http://www.tetragrammaton.org/truthintrans.htm

    Overall evaluation:
    Truth in Translation is an excellent book. It is well worth reading. BeDuhn has done an outstanding job of explaining and illustrating translation bias in the New Testament.

    However, this book will certainly polarize ones of Jehovah's Witnesses and evangelical Christians. BeDuhn makes a number of favorable comments regarding the New World Translation's handling of specific verses in contrast to the same verses in Bibles favored by evangelical Protestants. As a result, evangelical Protestants will (often, without merit) be suspicious of Truth in Translation.

    The Watch Tower Society will want to selectively quote BeDuhn's book because he compliments portions of the New World Translation. On the other hand, considering what Truth in Translation also says about the New World Translation in areas of its weakness, the Watch Tower Society will need to proceed cautiously when quoting Truth in Translation. BeDuhn devoted an entire appendix (The Use of "Jehovah") to the 237 occurrences of "Jehovah" in the New World Translation Greek Scriptures (New Testament). In that appendix he essentially denies the most prominent feature of the New World Translation's Greek Scriptures when he disputes the appropriateness of using Jehovah in the New Testament. We will consider that subject in the Appendix comments.

    In spite of my high praise for Truth in Translation, I do not agree with everything BeDuhn says. He also stumbles on his own bias in several places. I will comment on that where it is appropriate. I think it is fair to say this. On a first level, the translation principles BeDuhn describes are objective and are of extreme value. His academic qualifications demand that he be taken seriously. All of us from any theological persuasion need to carefully consider what he has to say regarding these translation principles.

    On a second level, BeDuhn chooses a number of passages to use as illustrations. Until I read the last chapter in which he explains his purpose for that choice, [*] I was becoming increasingly uncomfortable that he selected the passages in order to defend his personal view of Jesus and the Spirit (spirit). We need to pay careful attention to what the author says on this second level because he can teach us a great deal. This is where the theoretical meets the everyday application in the English New Testament translation we use. Nonetheless, because this second level involves considerably more subjective material, all of us as readers have the responsibility of cautiously weighing his comments before reaching our final conclusion.

    [*] In Chapter 13, BeDuhn says, "I could only consider a small number of samples in this book. Another set of samples might yield some different configurations of results. But the selection of passages has not been arbitrary. It has been driven mostly by an idea of where one is most likely to find bias, namely, those passages which are frequently cited as having great theological importance, the verses that are claimed as key foundations for the commitments of the belief held by the very people making the translations. Choosing precisely those passages where theology has most at stake might seem deliberately provocative and controversial. But that is exactly where bias is most likely to interfere with translation. Biblical passages that make statements about the nature and character of Jesus or the Holy Spirit are much more likely to have beliefs read into them than are passages that mention what Jesus and his disciples had for lunch." (p. 165)

    Finally, there is a third level in which BeDuhn is merely reflecting his own belief. As a reader, we are free to accept, modify or reject his point of view, but there is still much he can teach each of us in this final area also.

    May I suggest that Truth in Translation is a superb book. If both opponents and proponents of the New World Translation would apply the author's principles to their own translation selection, we would all reap the benefit of reading Bibles which better reflect the intended message of the New Testament authors.

    Our web site (www.tetragrammaton.org) is devoted to a study of the presence (or absence) of the Tetragrammaton [*] in the New Testament autographs. As such, our site is not a forum for discussing theology or even Bible translations. However, it does discuss the New World Translation Greek Scriptures (New Testament) at great length because of the Watch Tower Society's claim that the Tetragrammaton was used in the New Testament autographs. Based on this claim, the New World Translation is their vehicle for introducing Jehovah into the Greek Scriptures 237 times. For that reason, we have been drawn into this debate on New Testament translation bias because many of BeDuhn's examples are taken from the New World Translation.

    [*] The Tetragrammaton is the four letter Hebrew word (????) designating the divine name. Transliterated into English letters, it is written YHWH. Jehovah is a translation of ???? and Yahweh (among other possibilities) is a common English transliteration.

    From Truth in Translation's introduction:
    People are quick to charge inaccuracy and bias in someone else's Bible. On what basis do they make such charges? Charges of inaccuracy and bias are based upon the fact that a translation has deviated from some norm of what the translation should be. So what is the norm? It seems that for many the norm is the King James Version of the Bible. . . If a translation differs from the standard, clearly it must be wrong. . . But the fact that the general public does not have access to a valid norm does not mean that one does not exist. In fact there is such a norm that is available to anyone who is willing to take the trouble to learn how to use it: the original Greek New Testament. . . (pp. xiii-xvi)

    By claiming to be a translation, an English Bible is being put forward as an accurate communication of the meaning of the original text. . . .The important thing in judgments of accuracy is that the translators have found English words and phrases that correspond to the known meaning of the Greek, and put them together into English sentences that dutifully follow what the Greek syntax communicates.

    Accuracy in Bible translation has nothing to do with majority votes; it has to do with letting the biblical authors speak, regardless of where their words might lead. . .

    Accurate, unbiased translations are based on (1) linguistic content, (2) literary context, and (3) historical and cultural environment.

  • TD
    TD

    Letter courtesy of PSacramento:

  • Saoirse
    Saoirse

    BeDuhn also liked the Catholic version of the bible and criticized the use of the name Jehovah in the NWT. You won't see that mentioned in any JW chain email.

    It should also be pointed out that BeDeuhn's PhD from the University of IN is in Comparative Religious Studies, not in any Biblical languages. He is not recognized in any scholarly circles as being an expert in biblical languages.

  • dissed
    dissed

    Saoirse

    His Bio is impresive, but he is not a Biblical translation scholar. In other words, he is as qualified to comment on the accuracy of the NWT as you or I.

  • TD
    TD

    It's not unusual for an OT translator to hold a PhD in Semitic languages, Hebrew or both.

    Greek on the other hand is often incidental to the doctorate of contemporary NT translators. For some, Greek was a minor. New Testament, New Testament Studies, New Testament Exegesis, and Biblical Studies are common PhD's in this field.

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    TD posted the damning letter. Here was my encounter with this rumor: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/133542/1/NWT-on-Jeopardy-NOT along with my answer.

  • orangefatcat
    orangefatcat

    the biggest rumours always originate with the witnesses and seemingly come from Bethel. i recall in the 1970's witnesses around the Toronto Bethel where rumours were rampant that the new scrolls or the book of life were being printed. Can you believe some witnesses fell for this, like my aunt and mother for one. sheesh when will people ever get things straight and truthful.

    orangefatcat
    Whip



  • wha happened?
    wha happened?

    Not to mention a few years ago that the great trib had alread started. I had active JW's looking down their nose at me because they were right and I was wrong. Some of the apologized afterwards. Others stuck to their guns

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