Jews (from what I've read) have a fascinating perspective on the resurrection. It's kind of similar to dubs, except they concede science may play a role.
Google "Luz bone"... FASCINATING stuff...
The Resurection Hope Was Comforting....What Comfort Do You Now Have?
by minimus 77 Replies latest jw friends
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BurnTheShips
I've attempted to make this argument. I was unable to break through the WT-inspired misconceptions. Good luck!
When I was a JW, I had the same misconception. It was only after studying that I learned that Christians don't just believe they are going to heaven, they believe in a resurrection at the end of history. In the Christian "world to come", there will be no division between heaven and earth.
Many (mainline) Christians are returning (though the WT would like to pretend otherwise) are returning to the early Christian concept of a physical resurrection. Matter of fact, many Christians believe the New Heaven and the New Earth are one and the same (i.e. Heaven IS the "New Earth"). I happen to think the resurrection happens in a time and place where heaven and earth coalesce.
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away.....And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven..... And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men....And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
BTS
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leavingwt
What BTS said.
-LWT
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restrangled
V11 asked a serious question:
Why do so many people want to see dead relatives? I'm curious.
From my perspective, its not wanting to see old cranky relatives. It's about wanting to see those who left too soon. A 19 year old brother, a 40 something cousin and my father who died at 64. My dad gave me my last birthday card at age 40 with $200.00 to spend just on myself. He had a very dear side to him. He was dead 4 months later.
I'll never forget him and the hour we spent that day, after he pulled up in the car. We shared a glass of wine, and he told me how much he loved me. He also forbid me to spend the money on groceries, home repairs, etc., he said, " This is just for you~"
There wasn't enough time.....
r.
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VIII
Restrangled, thank you! I am really sorry you lost so many relatives so young. I have not lost any relatives at a young age. None died young. All were in their 70-90's.
I understand that concept. If my husband died *now*, I would be devestated. We are way too young and have so much we still want to do together. We just started something new and are really excited about it.
But, that is not to say I want to see him in Paradise. I have totally given up on that concept and I have totally discounted heaven/hell. He has not. He is a Roman Catholic and ardently wishes I would convert. I simply can't at this point and probably never will.
So, discounting The New System, how does one deal with the concept of not seeing people you previously thought you would? Like in Paradise?
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agonus
Agh, restrangled, my heartstrings are about to snap in half!
It's this kind of emotional appeal that snags so many dubs initially. At one time, the WT were master propagandists with that kind of approach. Now most of their energies are focused on propaganda devoted to "keeping 'em in" rather than catching 'em out there. The bait has been neglected at the expense of a fish hatchery that's totally polluted.
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chickpea
t'was the "resurrection hope" that
sucked me in, being a low hanging
fruit with a dead brother and son
in a calendar year.... total "heeeere
fishy fishy fishy", take-the-bait mistake
i doubt i can ever live down.....now, i take great comfort in knowing
i got to play on an evolving planet for
a while, and pass on a few strands of
DNA in the process!
stardust, everywhere i look!!
at the end of it all, i was one
of the "miracles" with cognitionhow improbable is that!!!
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agonus
right chickpea... like i said, from a nontheistic standpoint, the resurrection actually makes more sense.
Think of it this way: If the soul was something left totally up to God, then we're at God's mercy and there's no way to know for sure.
On the other hand, if the "soul" or consciousness is something that can be explained or quantified scientifically (it would by necessity have to be in a non-theistic/material universe), then "existence", however you define it, can be altered, perfected, even reproduced, no? Something like a cosmic computer sim, you know. Steven Weinberg has asked the question, "Is the universe a computer"? I believe it is. I call that "computer", for want of better word, "God."
If you've got unlimited quarters, who cares how many times you die in a video game?
I don't worry about death anymore. Not really.
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agonus
To be perfectly honest with you, I actually think existence/afterlife might actually be similar to the concept in "Groundhog Day". Death just pushes the global reset button.
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Gregor
I have the beautiful wife I married when she was 16, who just turned 62 and looks 42.
I have a plush leather rocker/recliner with a nice fuzzy throw blanket and lampstands stacked with so-far unread, no-booger, books on both sides. I remotely control a new 42" flatscreen and a great stereo. I have a laptop with wireless router and mouse.
Our larder and bar are stocked up. I look out the window next to me and see we have six inches of snow from last night but we keep the house at 66 degrees. The two Chihuahuas sleep in the big chair on my lap and legs under the throw. Every couple of days our grandbabies (Jack, 18 months and Miranda, 4) come and visit us for a couple of hours and we have a ball. We have one great-grandchild due in March and two more grandchildren on their way this summer.
I think this is all there is in life and I am content with having, hopefully, 15 years left to enjoy it. I can't imagine standing on one foot and the other, year after year, waiting for.....what?