A Demon Experience?......This was/is very serious to me.

by awildflower 49 Replies latest jw friends

  • WTWizard
    WTWizard

    This is almost certainly the result of the witlesses programming the children to expect demon possession if they disobey in even the slightest things. At that age, it is almost certain that this is either happening at night or during naps (even if momentary), or they are just acting out post-hypnotic suggestions found at the boasting sessions. And I am sure the "suggestion" the hounders will give them is more praying to Jehovah, more going to boasting sessions, more field circus, and getting rid of everything that is even suggestive of being worldly.

    With the programming being this deeply embedded (if this child has been a witless or associated with witlesses from a very early age, it sure has gone through their whole experiences), it is more difficult to throw out--and for the child to function as a regular person outside the cancer when grown up (that is what they want). And, taking them to regular church is only going to provoke more "demon possession", because the witlesses associate all other churches with demons. For sure, at this point trying to instill a measure of atheism or agnosticism (which would solve the whole problem) is useless, because the witlesses have programmed the child to expect more "demon attacks" as a result of doing this.

    I can also not rule out mental illness at some level, aside that which the witlesses themselves caused. There is always a possibility that mercury from vaccinations, or monosodium glutamate and/or aspartame from "food", has set this situation up to make it that much easier for the witlesses to do this sxxx. Very likely, children of witlesses get more than their share of monosodium glutamate at McDonalds from field circus. However, the real issue now is to eliminate the witlesses--all those violence-depicting books and rags have to go. It might be possible, despite that the witlesses continually bashing it as demonic, to wean such a child off the witlesses with books from a Christian bookstore or by going to regular church. It is not a perfect solution, and the witless programming may in fact cause the problem to get worse before it improves. But, it may well be worth a try.

  • TheOldHippie
    TheOldHippie

    My wife and I had as a friend a JW young woman who married a guy just as he became a JW. And things started to happen, circling around him. I don't feel like going into details, but we were called for and entered their apartment and saw it completely filled up with smoke thick as the thickest of fog. We sat down on their couch and it levitated to the ceiling. There were voices and stuff. They threw out a couch and the pigs at the nearby farm would run around screaming (or whatever it is called when pigs make this loud, thin noise) all night. Later they moved to another village where we visited them. There was a doorbell down at the entrance door at the ground floor and there was a doorbell outside their apartment in the third floor. The door at the ground floor was always locked. But the doorbell outside their apartment would ring and ring and ring - and there was nobody there. Piano music and talk as from a party from the apartment below them - when nobody was there. Lots and lots of nasty things. End of it was they both left JWs - and their only child, their son, suddenly died at the age of 14. She remarried and lives a solitary life with her husband as an artist never showing what she paints to anybody. Her husband, once well-known artist, also has redrawn into himself. The first husband, the sort of origin of it all, moved back to his parents and lives with them.

    A very disturbing life these have had. Destroyed by evil forces whatever they might be called.

    Please read Jung! C.G. Jung - start with "Memories, Drams, Reflections". The chapter on Life After Death is very moving. Jung was the founding father of modern psychatry together with Freud, but parted with Freud because he could not view Freud's anti-religious and "pro-sexual" ideas as the basis of interpretation of dreams etc. Jung was the father of psychoanalysis and word assosiation and - in short, please read Jung! He balances psychiatry with religious ideas in a beautiful way, he shows that you need not throw out religion just because psychiatry gives some clues and answers.

  • nelly136
    nelly136

    your family was in the millitary while you were jws?

  • Razziel
    Razziel

    I'll share my experience.

    Several years ago, I married a girl new to being a JW (now divorced). As far as I know, she had never had psychological problems before. A couple of years into the marriage her mood and outlook on life started getting very dark. I knew something was wrong but didn't know what. Things got worse very quickly. We would watch tv at night in bed before going to sleep, and when I would look over at her after making a comment with no response, she had appeared to have gone into some trance-like state. I could raise my voice, try to move her, etc., and I got no response. She was as stiff as a board. Her eyes were not glazed over as seeing something in her mind, but always fixed unmovingly at the doorway to the bedroom. We had a dog who slept in the bed, and when this happened he generallly got very agitated. He'd get up, the hair on his neck would stand, and he would bark at nothing. At first I attributed the dog's agitation to my visible tension at trying to get my wife out of whatever state she was in, but on several later occurences, the dog's agitation is what led me to look over at my wife and see her in that state. This happened dozens of times over the course of about 3 months.

    After anywhere from five to fifteen minutes. she would "wake up" and be hysterical. Crying, sobbing, and shivering uncontrollably. She would let me hold her to comfort her, but refused to talk about it at all. She wouldn't answer any direct questions. After that, we would finally go to sleep, and everything would seem ok until it always happened again a few nights later.

    At this time, I was inactive for several reasons related to injustice, but still thought overall JWs were the truth. Two years before I had resigned being a MS and a regular pioneer. With my beliefs at the time, it didn't take long for me to suspect some demonic source as the cause of this. The second to last time this happened, I started asking her questions around the subject instead of direct "what is going on" questions, and then I started getting some answers. I asked if she wouldn't talk to me because she didn't want to, or because she couldn't for other reasons. She replied other reasons. I asked if someone had told her not to discuss it. Replied yes. I asked if this someone was there in the room with us. Reply was "I can't say".

    I asked why specifically she couldn't tell me, and got no answer. I asked her if she was aware of me talking and moving her during her trances. She said yes. I asked why she couldn't respond to me during the trances. No answer. I asked if something physically kept her from reacting to me. Reply yes. I asked if that something was the same person who forbid her to talk to me about this. No answer.

    Then I asked was a physical threat involved. Answer yes. Was it against her? Answer no. Was it against me? Answer yes. Does it involve death? Answer yes. I stopped the questions for a couple of minutes to think. She went into the trance again, the first time I'd actually seen it start. She had been looking at me, then something behind me caught her attention, and she went frigid.

    At this point, I directly verbally addressed what I believed to be the source of the problems. I didn't speak angrily or say any threats. I chose my words carefully, but I will not repeat what I said. I did not invoke Jehovah's name, but I did invoke Christ. I spoke confidently and authoritatively in an elevated voice.

    The wife came out of the trance and went hysterical. I got nothing further out of her that night, and I didn't sleep. This was the last time I observed her like this. The next day I went hunting the house for anything in our possessions (since that was what we were all tought as JWs). An aunt across the country had sent some family items a few months before, and I found a catholic saint's icon that was a family heirloom that I didn't know had been sent. I got rid of it.

    A couple of weeks went by and the nighttime was peaceful. We didn't speak about what had happened. I noticed things did not return to the way they were before however, so I asked if everything was ok. She wouldn't answer and I had to go through the process of elimination again, but what I learned is that the "someone" no longer bothered her when I was home, but visited her during the day while I was at work (she worked part-time and was off several days of the week). As a result, she left the house most days so she wouldn't have to deal with it.

    I would like to say, that regardless of my beliefs at the time, I still thought schizophrenia or some other disorder could be the cause of this, since I had not witnessed anything of supernatural nature. We had many counseling sessions, visited psychiatrists, and she was prescribed a number of various medications.

    Over the next couple of months, she spent less and less time at home, even at night, sleeping over with friends. This put a big strain on the marriage. Finally, she confided that the "someone" had told her that it wanted me, but couldn't have me, so it would settle for her. This culminated in two almost successful suicide attempts over the next three months, where she was hospitalized. She also (unrelated to suicide attempts) totaled three vehicles she was driving during this time, and was institutionalized against her will twice during this period. Unfortunately a legal obstacle to getting people the help they need is that if a person can cogently convince institutional doctors they are fine, and aren't a continuing threat to themselves (even if they just tried to kill themselves!!!), the state can only hold them for a short period of time and must release them.

    She later told me the "someone" was there coaching her when she tried to kill herself. Our marriage did not last much longer after this. She emerged from this experience a very different person from whom I married, and soon had several affairs. I was willing to work through this, but she decided she needed to get away from this area, got a job transfer, and moved across country. She seemed to just want a permanent seperation, but I made the decision to initiate divorce rather than living in limbo and just remain friends if this is what she needed to do. That was five years ago, and we've both gone on to make new lives for ourselves.

    I asked her once recently if she still had any "experiences" and she said occasionally, but nothing to the degree of what happened towards the end of our marriage. Since all of this, I went back to school and finished a degree. With increased education, I now lean to think she was secretly unhappy with the marriage and saw no honorable way out, but kept it bottled up. I think this eventually led to what appeared to her as a physical manifestation of her inner emotions. It is medically documented by brain patterns in schizophrenics that what they see and hear is reality from their point of view. I see no reason to believe this couldn't temporarily happen in an otherwise normal person due to extreme stress or emotional turmoil. Further, she had only recently been exposed by JWs to the concept of demons and evil spirit creatures who have the power to manifest in the physical realm. For a person previously unrelated to that belief, it can be a frightening concept, and I find it reasonable that may be how her inner turmoil manifested itself in a way she would have to consciously confront.

    Pets can be sensitive to our moods and vibes, and I think the dog immediately noticed when she zoned out. He knew something wasn't right, but he didn't know what, so he randomly barked at a threat perceived through his observation of her. I've gone on to experiment some with that. If I begin to act nervous or otherwise uncharacteristic around my dog, they will feel nervous or threatened purely based on my behaviour at some unseen threat.

  • awildflower
    awildflower

    StoneWall, no he's not an elder anymore. You make a great point about angels and demons if they exist at all. Just yesterday I was telling my daughter about this thread and we were talking about the subject (although she doesn't remember hardly anything about her experience) and she said to me, "how come, if there are some spirit creatures out there, that we only hear about evil ones causing harm or problems, wouldn't we hear about good angels to or see "good" angels in our daily lives guiding us and making us feel good?" I told her that was an excellent point and I'd bring it up on here, so maybe someone could comment on that to.

    Wizard and Frankie, I'm keeping an open mind to all the ideas.

    OldHippie, thank you for the book recommendation, I'll check it out. It feels so odd to have an experience like yours or mine and know what it must sound like but also knowing that it was real! Nelly, my husband was never a jw. After we married I went back to my childhood religion, jw's and I raised my kids like that up until a year ago. Although he never opposed any of it and even studied for the 14 years we've been married ,off and on, he never became a jw. Thank God for him.

    Razziel, welcome and thanks for sharing your experience. It must have been very stressful but it's nice to hear you've moved on with a better life. It was very well written as well and look forward to your thoughts.

  • Mary
    Mary

    Um, how can active Witnesses be in the military? Isn't that a disfellowshipping offence?

    Be that as it may, one of my best friends' daughter had a creepy experience when they moved into an old war-time house about a year ago. Her little boy (he was about 4 years old) started acting rather strange. One time they were sitting there and he just suddenly looked right past his mom and started talking to something that wasn't there. When his mom asked him who he was talking to, he didn't answer and didn't even seem to hear her and she said it looked almost like he was in a frigging trance or something. He also started telling her about seeing 'people' in his room at night which scared the hell out of him. The house apparently had a really creepy feeling to it and she always felt like there was 'something evil' that was there with her watching her. They moved out about 5 months ago and her son's been fine since then.

  • awildflower
    awildflower

    Mary, I , the baptized jw, was not in the military, my husband who was NOT a jw, was in the military. And I got baptized AFTER I got married so no df'ing offense.

  • jookbeard
    jookbeard

    Razziel; thanks for sharing that, amazing.

  • Quillsky
    Quillsky

    I'm amazed that nobody has brought up what would be a true skeptic's response to a 7-year-old girl making sexualized comments related to her bed.

    You have to consider the possibility that your daughter was being exposed to sexually inappropriate behavior. It may have been sexual abuse by her father or older brother or someone else, it may merely have been her brother or cousin or friend discussing sexual topics.

    As a skeptic, my theory would be that inappropriate behavior ceased once the family began focusing on her unusual comments and the mattress. Hence her displays of terror ceased.

    Many mothers have been documented as being in complete denial about the sexual abuse of their children.

    But please, this cannot and should not be discounted in the favor of the absurd "Demonized Mattress" theory.

  • Quillsky
    Quillsky

    Oh and that elder, does he do exorcisms too?

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