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JWs growing in numbers despite opposition and criticism from apostates and other religious commentators. Why?
by african GB Member 55 Replies latest jw friends
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OUTLAW
This Thread needs to be Re-Titled..
Jehovah`s Witness`s GROANING in numbers..
Despite opposition and criticisim by Jehovah`s Witness`s..
Of anyone not a Jehovah`s Witness..
............................. ...OUTLAW
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observador
Besides all the comments - and some good jokes - the good people here have posted, think about what's happening for a moment: Take the country of Brazil, for instance, the second country in number of JWs in the world. It was very common, in the 1960, growth rate of 20%, 23%, etc.
This growth rate has been declining ever since the mid-70s. It has decreased to 15% in the 70s, 10% average in the 80s, 6% in the 90s. Now it wont't get greater than 4% in the first decade of the 2000s.
If I was a leader of a religion concerned with numbers, as the JW is, I'd be worried.
Observador
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observador
A little thing called 'reproduction'. End of story.
Reproduction doesn't explain their growth.
On one hand, many of us criticize the JW religion for not encouraging marriage and having kids. Then, we try to explain their growth by reproduction. It doesn't make any sense.
The JW religion may in fact be growing (not sure here because they can easily fudge those numbers), but even if that is happening, the reduction of their success rate is real and very disconcerting for a religion paranoid with numbers.
Obs
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nugget
The number of witnesses is worked out on the basis of number reporting. These figures can be misinterpreted espeacially peaks. For example if someone fails to report on a given month but later hands in a report for all 12 months of the service year they are counted as 12 people.
What is more significant is the slowing down of the rate of growth. If you look forward people who have been in the organisation when growth was greater will start dying off and the small rate of growth will start to reverse and become a decline. The society actively discourages couples having children so although some old members are replaced by new births a proportion of growth is required from converts and in the countries with a mature prescene the rate of growth from this source is minimal. The society needs new territory to preach the message and see the best growth and the world is finite.
Bear in mind too that the new system is based on the premise that some older members will still be there at the end. As these die off and middle aged become elderly then the doubts in some members of the R&F will also increase. People who never expected to grow old will be facing their own mortality unprepared. Doubts will inevitably arise.
Growth does not mean truth after all microsoft has grown relatively quickly into a multi billion dollar company but no one suggests that they are worthy of worship.
Jesus said love was how his followers would be identified so that is how we need to judge religon and as far as JWs are concerned they are way down on that one.
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JWoods
Two things which we should remember (which may be forgotten by the 21st century JW people) -
1. After the decline in numbers post 1975, there was actually a pro-childbirth phase in the JW literature. Articles about natural home childbirth in the Awake, a circuit overseer slide show with pictures of the embryo in development, etc. A number of years passed (at least 5, before I left) when no longer was it stated to "avoid having children until after armageddon". I have long believed since I saw this as a late 1970s elder (with disbelief considering their position in the previous decade) that this was done to increase the born-in witness population at a time of numbers losses.
2. The JWs used to state with great pride that they were "the fastest growing religion on earth" up until the 1975 failure. This was a point of contention between the JWs and the Mormons, who both claimed the title. It was probably never true of either, except by obtuse statistical masturbations. But at the time, this was "proof the Watchtower had the holy spirit". I guess this is not mentioned any longer.
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metatron
Wow! There'has been an increase in people who put down figures on a small piece of paper once a month, often under the duress of being hunted down or called on the phone to demand such numbers! 7 million of 'em! And there's no objective way to check the activity reported!
It all reminds me of the final stage of Communism. More tractors , more tanks, more missiles, and it all loses money! More nations, more proletariat, more Socialism and more defectors, more stagnation, more black markets and more disallusioned young people.
It's all becoming a facade, a collection of 'white-washed graves' - and if you doubt that, then ask yourself why the Watchtower expressedly avoids surveys and other objective measures of just how wonderful their "spiritual paradise" is! If they really think they have a 'paradise' , let's see hard stats on divorce, family breakdown, anti-depressant drug use, mental illness, or sucide.
No you won't find those things honestly discussed - not even to the extent they discussed them in years gone by, especially at conventions. Nope, instead you will read about those problems discussed in the 'Awake" while concealing the fact that Witnesses are involved. Vague descriptions of "Some Christians" or other ambiguity serves the purpose of their deception in regard to the decay of the organization.
metatron
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diamondiiz
I would be surprised if there was no growth at this time. IMO wts is going to peak within the next 10 years but most likely within next 5. My reasons are simple theory that hard times drive more people to believe the end is imminent. After all, aren't all the signs here? US in bankrupt and as people were looking to Europe with it's mighty Euro as another possible alternative, the Europe proved to be burning as Greece is the first of the group to show it's weakness with Spain, Portugal and Italy close behind - mind you this is nothing when compared to Calfornia or Florida.... Anyways, IMO the crisis that started in '08 is nowhere near the end but has experiences mass stimulas in '09 which caused the markets to rally while not much jobs have been created. People lossing jobs, uncertainty and poverty help cults like wts to recruit people that are at their end and who believe the story that God's kingdom must be near especially since Jesus returned in 1914 :) IF the global situation does deteriorate as I think it will in the next several years, I'm guessing more DFed will return and more suckers will join expecting an imminent Armageddon. But I'm guessing this peak will roll over with many people getting disillusioned with wts and finally leaving in droves as their imminent end turns to no event. Only then do I see some sort of internal crisis, either break up in to 2 or more sects or some sort of major changes that will see many leave the cult such as elimination of 1914 or change of 1914 to some other date.
just my 2 cents
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Nathan Natas
Isn't it also true that the vast majority of people who are RAISED as JWs end up leaving the WTB&TS organization?
There will always be neurotics, psychotics, masochists and the emotionally unstable who are drawn to an organization that offers the promise of everlasting life, an eternal free lunch, and the "two witness rule."
Although the Bereans were complimented for making sure of all things, ACCORDING TO THE BIBLE, virtually no one who followed Christ took the time to investigate who he was and what he was selling; they just stopped what they were doing and began following him.
Religion is typically NOT a choice any person makes with their rational intellect, but with their emotional "feelings." How else can you explain that around the world, most people worship whatever god their parents told them was the right one to worship?
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winstonchurchill
A little thing called 'reproduction'. End of story.
That would explain part of the growth in the past. Currently JW's have the lowest retention rate (about 20%), which means only 1 out of 5 of those born as JW stay in the religion when they grow up, this according to a study Time (or was it Newsweek?) published some 4 years ago.
I think is a combination of many factors pointed here:
1) There's no significant growth; WT's 'publisher accounting' method is peculiar to say the least.
2) Many fake time (but by doing it they show they consider themselves JW's).
3) Frequently elders make fake reports for those not turning a slip (to look good before the CO).
4) There are people joining the religion (thousands get baptized every year), but this is offset by those leaving.
