Please could someone tell me what is said in a JW baptism? I was told that JW baptisms are invalid because they do not baptise in the "name of the Father and of the Son and Of the Holy Spirit. Because of this invalid baptism a Catholic cannot marry a JW with church approval, I think. They are NOT considered Christians.
Validity of JW Baptism
by maputo95 26 Replies latest watchtower medical
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Gopher
"1) On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, have you repented of your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will?
2) Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization?
(The Watchtower, April 1st 2006, pages 21-25)
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maputo95
Thanks Gopher-so no mention by the baptiser of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost? If these words are absent, aren't they going against Scipture as Matthew 28:19 says:
- ". . .baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit,. . ."
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Found Sheep
oh i got that sick feeling in my stomach when i read that!!! I used to get all teary eyed at that and no I think how much of a waist it is!!!
2) Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization?
inother words... will you do everything the BG tells you to do and never question them!!! Or will will kick you out!!!
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blondie
They do say Jehovah (God) and Jesus but the direct mention of the holy spirit was twisted to "spirited-directed."
Those questions were the ones from 1985 to now.
These are the two questions that are asked of Jehovah's Witness 'baptismal candidates' as a group just before they they are baptized. The questions have evololved over the years. Only the most recent set of questions mentions the organization.
Baptismal questions from the August 1, 1966 Watchtower, p. 465:
(1) Have you recognized yourself before Jehovah God as a sinner who needs salvation, and have you acknowledged to him that this salvation proceeds from him, the Father, through his Son Jesus Christ?
(2) On the basis of this faith in God and in his provision for salvation, have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to God to do his will henceforth as he reveals it to you through Jesus Christ and through the Bible under the enlightening power of the holy spirit?Baptismal questions from the May 15, 1970 Watchtower, p. 309:
(1) Have you recognized yourself as a sinner and needing salvation from Jehovah God? And have you acknowledged that this salvation proceeds from him and through his ransomer, Christ Jesus?
(2) On the basis of this faith in God and in his provision for redemption have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to Jehovah God, to do his will henceforth as that will is revealed to you through Christ Jesus and through God's Word as his holy spirit makes it plain?Baptismal questions from the May 1, 1973 Watchtower, p. 280:
(1) Have you repented of your sins and turned around, recognizing yourself before Jehovah God as a condemned sinner who needs salvation, and have you acknowledged to him that this salvation proceeds from him, the Father, through his Son Jesus Christ?
(2) On the basis of this faith in God and in his provision for salvation, have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to God to do his will henceforth as he reveals it to you through Jesus Christ and through the Bible under the enlightening power of the holy spirit?The newest baptismal questions, from the June 1, 1985 Watchtower:
(1) On the basis of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, have you repented of your sins and dedicated yourself to Jehovah to do his will?
(2) Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization? -
only me
I could be wrong, but doesn't the person doing the actual dunking say'"In the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit." ?
I think I remember them doing that, but it's been a long time since I paid attention at a baptism.
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Gopher
Only me,
When I was baptized in 1977, the JW "brother" doing the dunking only gave me instructions about which hand I should use to plug my nose, and to hold my breath. There was no "in the name of the father, son and holy spirit" in the JW's. Maybe the Baptists do that, I don't know.
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garyneal
Maybe the Baptists do that, I don't know.
I can only speak for the Independent Fundamental Baptists because I was baptized in one of their churches. It's been 20 years since I've been baptized but it is considered valid as they are considered a valid church.
The jist from what I can recall went something like this:
The pastor asked me if I accepted Jesus as my Lord and savior and then baptized me in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
As he dunked me he said, "Death to your old life." While I was under he said, "Burial." Then he lifted me up and said, "Resurrection, as a new creature in Christ."
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carla
Most 'Christians' do not consider jw's Christian due to their doctrines not necessarily the baptism questions which most churches and ministers are totally unaware of.
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GLTirebiter
Because of this invalid baptism a Catholic cannot marry a JW with church approval, I think. They are NOT considered Christians.
In principal, a Catholic could marry a Witness. Permission must be obtained for any mixed Catholic-non Catholic marriage (if it is to be a sacramental marriage, considered valid by the Church). The real impediment to marrying a Witness is found at the end of this article of the Catechism: the Witness must allow the Catholic party to pratice the faith and remain in the Church, and the children must be baptized and educated in the Catholic Church. No faithful Witness could honestly agree to that!
1635 According to the law in force in the Latin Church, a mixed marriage needs for liceity [#] the express permission of ecclesiastical authority. In case of disparity of cult [*] an express dispensation from this impediment is required for the validity of the marriage. This permission or dispensation presupposes that both parties know and do not exclude the essential ends and properties of marriage; and furthermore that the Catholic party confirms the obligations, which have been made known to the non-Catholic party, of preserving his or her own faith and ensuring the baptism and education of the children in the Catholic Church.
The non-scriptural form of JW baptism does mean that if they wish to convert to Catholicism, they must be baptised again, "In the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit". That is not the case for most Protestant sects, because they do baptize in the Christian form: the church considers anyone baptized according to Matt 29 to be Christians, whether or not they are Catholic.
Glossary of peculiar words and phrases
[#] "Licety" means the marriage is "licit" (valid, legal): the opposite of "illicit"
[*] "Disparity of cult" means of different religions