"Polly wanna cracker!"
Yes, Polly, but ultimately, it's up to YOU to WANT the cracker. We cannot make you want the cracker for you.
"Polly wanna cracker!"
OK Polly, will you swear to that in court?
Help me understand the WTS/JW eschatology
by Doug Mason 19 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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Heaven
When I was a kid (back in the '60s and '70s), it was never made clear to me what the activities would be once Armageddon had come. I honestly believe that my Mom didn't know either. So some of this stuff is 'new' info. to me.
Doug, in your first set of statements, you say that 'a number of people have heard the message and rejected it', however, I don't see listed how peoples who have never heard the message are considered. I assume that with JWs today, it's the same as it was when I was a kid. There is no consideration for these people (because there aren't supposed to be any like this... yeah...right!).
What used to bother me about this belief is all the people who had never heard the message. JWs never addressed this possibility/probability. In my lifetime there have been several discoveries of peoples on the Earth that no one knew existed before they were stumbled upon. This has always bothered me because of the JW stance that everyone was going to have 'a chance'. So I always like to ponder which JW or JWs get assigned to these newly discovered peoples. I bet the answer is 'no one'. Ray Franz also stated that JWs in Morocco were instructed NOT to witness to Muslims. So there is a whole segment of society that is not hearing their message as well.
Just because you knock on someone's door and shove a magazine at them doesn't mean you've delivered a coherent and understandable/understood 'message'.
Once again, I whole-heartedly agree with agonus and Chalam. The constant changes they make confuse people and no one really knows what the current truth or 'light' is. For elderly people, they can't keep up. The aging mind does not adapt well to or even accept change. Even my Dad recently told me he has no idea what they're saying at the meetings.
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designs
Can we say 'nobody has a clue'....... but it keeps the religious woundup tight.
The Society keeps trying to pound a square peg in a round hole much like Fundmentalists keep trying to paint the Second Coming around every time the USA gets a jones to invade Iraq.
Silly business and a huge waste of time when they all could be spending their energies solving real problems in this world.
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bohm
bttt, would love to have this 'okayed' by some more of our resident scholars so i could print it out! :-)
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FloridaPerry
I asked a JW about this a while back and never got a good answer. Altho there are different ideas about what will happen in the end times, MOST Christians have similar beliefs. Not these guys, from what I can tell. Thanks for the post.
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Vidiot
The way I'd always understood it was like this:
- the "Wild Beast" (UN) turns on "Babylon the Great" (non-JW religion)
- the "King of the North" (whoever that is) follows up by cracking down hard on JWs
- the "King of the South" (Anglo-American West) follows suit
- world "Peace and Security" is declared
- everybody except JWs are wiped out in a spectacular display of supernatural vengeance
I may have some of it wrong.
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designs
Christian Churches have their own plethora of ideas. In the Eartern Orthodox you have 'Particular Judgement' and 'General Judgement'. In Roman Catholicism you have the 'Perfecting of physical pain or bliss'. In the Protestant world you have Pre-Tribulation, Mid-Tribulation, Post-Tribulationists.
Amillenialism and Postmillennialism. Lutherans reject any idea of a earthly kingdom others, including the RCC believe in the earthly kingdom. Protestants are divided on what happens between death and judgement. Some inject Soul Sleep to describe this period others describe a semi-conscious state of bliss or sadness.
Some think 'Death' is destroyed after the Great Tribulation' and others after the Millennium.
Should 'Christians' call the Watchtower's ideas any more disjointed and controversial than their own varied speculations.
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bohm
Doug, i send you a PM.
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trillaz
Doug, just about correct as far as current printed doctrine. One thing that needs to be clarified is that the club of 144000 did not begin to count until 1918, not 1914, per WTS. This is the year that Jesus was to have inspected the F&DS and at that time those who where judged by him as riteous were now labled the F&DS per Matthew 24:46. The labeling was by Jesus not by JWs at that time since JWs did not realize that had occured (1914 kingdom,1919 F&DS) until 1935.