At a loss what to do RE: JW family and my kids (page 5)

tec

Alice:

She's lying because JW's don't act like this?

If she's telling the truth, then she deserves it?

These two statements are in complete conflict with one another. You do realize this, right?

Tammy

alice.in.wonderland

"Alice:

She's lying because JW's don't act like this?

If she's telling the truth, then she deserves it?

These two statements are in complete conflict with one another. You do realize this, right?

Tammy"

Telling the truth about her family being brainwashed robots. If she really believes this, she might as well terminate communication with these family members asap. If she really believes they're people and not programmed by some puppet master than she's lying.

If I used science fiction: government or religious mind control to describe my family they wouldn't like me either. Everyone in my family is scientifically literate so they don't use suggested brainwashing theories without empirical proof to describe each other. That's very immature.

tec

Alice - I didn't get that from what you said, so thanks for answering me.

On a personal note, it seems to me that she is trying to act in the right way despite how her family has treated her. She was honest to them, about not believing. Then it would appear that she and her husband were treated very badly, in that they were cut off.

But the point is not who did what wrong first - even if we didn't believe her story. The point - and question - is, would you trust your very young children to be alone with people who hate you? Or at the very least, people who will have nothing to do with you? Because if they don't respect you, could you trust them to respect your wishes regarding what your children be taught?

Tammy

goldensky

Oh dear! I'm beginning to be worried about myself becoming unforgiving or something. All of you sound so tolerant to me advising 2pink not to allow the grandparents to visit the kids without supervision, but to still let them see them with the parents around. I'd be much more radical in this case. This is how I'd plainly put it to them: "When you treat us, my husband and me, with the love and respect we are entitled to, you will have the privilege of enjoying our kids, of course with us present all the time, like normal families do. We hope you come to your senses. We really want you to. We love you, but we won't tolerate the insane way you are behaving towards us. We are a pack, and either you accept the whole lot of us or you can't have any".

Dear 2pink, for goodness' sake, don't tolerate that behaviour towards you and your husband! You are too sweet to be treated like that...

Elder-Patrol

I'm not inclined to assume the worst about JWs, but the fact remains that any JW will see his commitment to evangelism as a higher commitment than pleasing a family member. Grandma certainly shouldn't promise one thing and do another, but it will likely be impossible for her to keep silent about her faith whatever her earlier promises.

The child will learn nothing useful under mother's apron strings, and at some point will benefit from other perspectives. Consider:

Explain to the child the basics of a few belief systems: spirits in trees (aka animism), or hundreds of gods (aka mythologies).

Explain some basics of what Grandma believes.

Explain to the child that of hundreds of belief systems, most (all?) are wrong, and why.

Explain that a civilized person is respectful of others' beliefs, but he can also ask others to be respectful of his beliefs.

Explain that it is respectful to say, "I'm not comfortable discussing this. Can we talk about something else?"

Black Sheep

Alice, you know damned well that these grandparents are discouraged from associating with their children and that the article is duplicated on their own public website so that Apostates, like you, can be shown to be liars if they attempt to portray your doctrines and practices as something other that what they really are.

I wouldn't let a believing member of any high control group have any unsupervised access until such time as the kids have been educated to recognize the kind of faulty logic that they are going to use on them. I doubt you have done this, as the kids are so young.

Google, "Teach your Child How To Think"

Tell them that you are a package deal, a family, and they are welcome to behave like family and see all of you together.

They made a choice to bring their chidren up in a religious group that practices shunning its non believing offspring. You didn't ask them to do that. It was a gamble that didn't pay off. Armageddon didn't arrive and their children left. They lost their gamble. Now they have to decide what price they are going to pay.

Cheers

Chris

Aussie Oz

many children never see their grand parents. My family left england when i was 3 and i never saw any again until 5 years ago. By then 'gran' was getting a bob short of a dollar and i had no emotional conection to her.

a shame? cant miss what you never had.

If it were me, i would tell them, 'no way' see us as a family or not at all. They are willing to cut off you, cut off them from the kids. It's not about tit for tat either.

It sounds harsh i know, but trust me, at their ages, they wont even know about it. Many many families these days have 'grand parents' as some distant irrelivant old people, or they may live so far away as to not really be relevant at all.

If they can cut you off, then you can rely on them cutting off the more removed grand kids if need be.

its 100% about them trying to salvage the kids out of the trainwreck they think you are.

oz

cab1000

We are in the same boat. (Must be a big boat) Our kids were about that age (and younger) when we decided to leave. We live a couple of hours away from our families, so it may be a little easier.

The kids (and just the kids) were invited to a JW party a couple of weeks ago. We turned it down. We totally agree that by letting that happen, it teaches the kids that we as parents are doing something wrong, we know it, and respect the treatment, because we are wrong. Well, we do not believe that, and certainly do not want to teach our kids that.

For me, it's kind of strange. Growing up as a JW, I did not get to see any of my grandparents or extended family very much, because they were bad association. Now, the tables have turned, and the very same thing is happening for my kids, just the other way around. Boy, this religion really blows! Get out, stay out, and don't look back!

CuriousButterfly

Alice's Quote: I don't even take the “family” stories ppl tell here at all seriously. I know many families with unbelieving family members. Jehovah's Witnesses never take this antagonistic rant toward unbelieving family. Whether the supposed “family members” exist or not they're nothing but expendable pawns in your anti-JW scheme.

You are criticizing with a huge brush stroke. Your statement is completely untrue. I have known MANY JWs shun their family. In my situation I have had siblings disfellowshipped my family (myself/husband/parents) never shunned them. We loved them no matter what. This is rare since my family is very active for over 35 yrs.

carla

Never, ever leave your child alone with these people! Your first responsibility is to protect your children and that includes their physical, mental, spiritual and emotional well being. I don't believe a 4-5 yr old is mature enough to understand the shunning aspects of the cult. Nor should they think you in any way condone it by bending to their crazy ways. Your parents are not able to behave civil with you and your husband? they don't have to like you but they sure can act appropriate in front of the children. Your parents will try to indoctrinate them at any chance they can, it's just the jw way. I would flat out tell them that if they want to see them they are welcome to come over to your home and you could all have a meal, play a game, go to the park, and spend some quality time together but you will not ever leave the children alone with them while they treat you and your husbands so disrepectfully. You certainly do not want to teach your children that it is ok for people to crap on you while you just sit back and take such abuse.

Think your child is missing out on grandparents? Nursing homes and neighborhoods are filled with lonely older people who would love to spoil your children! You can adopt a child why not a grandparent? maybe you will even find an ex jw who needs a family now too!

As for local troll-" You'll only get advice about this “situation” from those that enjoy a study diet of supermarket tabloid."- this is why you come here? it is your version of the National Enquirer? that is what this board is! people who have been harmed or are still being abused by the wt and its followers who seek advice from people who have already survived it.

At a loss what to do RE: JW family and my kids

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