Dogpatch, this cannot be imposed on anyone, and it has nothing to do with changing beliefs or following someone else's lead because they know what's best for everyone - that has to be recognized for the "old consciousness" that it is. Any kind of agenda is just more of the same. It cannot be turned into a movement, either. That only results in all those things you mentioned. It is an organic growth that flowers within the individual when that individual drops entirely his reliance on ideologies and beliefs and makes an honest inquiry into what is actually true and what is imagined or believed to be true.
The Impossibility of Utopia? A Response to Humanism by John Gray
by Dogpatch 16 Replies latest jw friends
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Dogpatch
Yes, that is the basics of Humanism.
Man's effort to do what "god" is supposed to do. He didn't do it, and apparently won't so WE MUST.
It hasn't worked in all of recorded human history, and is not likely to, if at all, in the next few thousand years, unless man were to evolve into a different species. More likely he will be eaten by a different species.
LOL Even Stephen Hawking is warning it "may not be a good idea" to contact extra-terrestrials. :-))
Geee, wonder why?
Because all of nature we know is guided by survival of the fittest and most powerful; not wishful thinking.
Randy
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poppers
Yes, that is the basics of Humanism.
It hasn't worked in all of recorded human history, and is not likely to, if at all, in the next few thousand years, unless man were to evolve into a different species. More likely he will be eaten by a different species.
"Humanism" is just another concept to embrace or discard. As soon as you say, "Yes, that's humanism" you've bought into a concept and pigeon-holed it into something you either agree with or not. It's as though the conceptual has replaced reality. It's not about believing in a certain kind of reality, it's about directly seeing/realizing reality itself.
The conceptual world is the world of separation - it's not about that; that's "old consciousness". Step out of concepts entirely and "old consciousness" disappears; so, what's present then? That's what I'm pointing to. What's difficult about what I'm talking about is that the conceptual is being used to point to what is non-conceptual. All philosophies, all religions, all ideologies are all conceptual, and none of it is reality - all of it is conditioned (old) consciousness. What I'm talking about and pointing to is what is not touched by any of that, and has nothing to do with "wishful thinking". What you are experiencing right now in reading and responding to what I'm saying is more "old consciousness" - what's present when that is no longer operating? Without that are "you" separate from "me"?
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Dogpatch
OK, getting off the scale for me here....
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poppers
OK, getting off the scale for me here....
A good first step.
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AK - Jeff
Well, mankind may never find 'utopia' - but making an effort sure is better than sitting around with our thumb up our asses waiting for 'God' to do so. Besides, who says utopia is a good idea to begin with. How bout just life as it is? Still pretty grand.
Or we could do as the narrator in the vid - sit about hoping for an invisible 'fixer' to show up and whisk us off to 'salvation' - gee - what's better? Take life as it is? Or expect the great absentee God/Son to show someday?
Jeff
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cognizant dissident
I think "Utopia" is a denial of the reality of man's nature and the nature of this world, which is that we are all animals and almost every living creature rips each other apart for food, territory, mates, etc. So in that sense, I agree with Randy.
However, that being said, I think there are a certain element of humans who have evolved beyond this consciousness (ode to Popper here). They may be in the minority, they may be doomed to destruction by the violent masses. Who knows?
But as Ak-Jeff said, that does not mean we should just sit around and twiddle our thumbs . If we can conceive of a higher consciousness, of ideals that promote construction and not destruction, for humanity and all the species, and the planet, then, even if we are in the minority, even if we are doomed to failure (and how can we know that ahead of time?) we owe it to ourselves to at least make an effort to bring forth our constructive vision into being.
The alternative is to join the animals in ripping each other apart. We all have this duality to live with. We all have a choice which "dog" to feed.