Encounter with JW's on the Street

by OnTheWayOut 26 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    I was pushing my sister's wheelchair as we were enjoying the perfect
    Saturday Noon weather. We were going to a local restaurant to get
    something to eat. I saw a well-dressed Hispanic man in his twenties
    with an African American boy. (I only mention races because it tells me
    they are not father and son. The guy wasn't old enough to have a son
    that old either.) I guessed the boy to be as old as 12.
    My sister said he was probably 10, no more than 11. They were waiting
    on the north side of an intersection for the crossing light. We were
    waiting on the south corner going the opposite way.

    The Hispanic man nudged the boy and pointed at us, indicating that they
    should wait until we crossed and that the boy should "place" something
    with us.

    So we cross and he pulls out a flyer that asked a question something
    like "Do you want to know THE TRUTH." "THE TRUTH was bold on the 2nd
    line and I don't remember the specific question. His presentation was
    just "We would like to offer you some literature." I didn't know these
    fellows at all so I decided the game was on.

    OTWO: "What do you know about "the truth" ?

    The JW Boy gave an exact worded presentation that he had memorized. It
    went something like this:
    JW Boy: "The brochure takes you to your Bible to see that God has a
    purpose that is being fulfilled today."

    I wasn't interested in a discussion of God's purpose, so I decided to
    take the conversation directly to one subject that might help the boy.
    OTWO: "Do you even know 'the truth' about the organization you are
    working with?"

    JW Boy: "What do you mean?"

    OTWO: "Do you know that if you were to get baptized and later change your
    mind about your faith, your Witness family will probably shun you for the
    rest of your life."

    JW Man (wanting to take over): "That's not true."

    OTWO: "You know it is"

    JW Man: "People don't shun their own family members."

    OTWO: "I am talking about this boy specifically, not outside family members.
    If he gets baptized as a young person, then at age 18 or so, decides to
    join the military or go to another church or celebrate holidays, he can and
    probably will be shunned by his Witness family for the rest of his life."

    JW Man: "That simply isn't true."

    OTWO: "You ask him to offer me a flyer about learning 'the truth,' yet you
    stand here lying about your own organization. YOu know it happens all the
    time."

    JW Man: "I disagree with anyone that does that."

    OTWO: "Then you know it happens, yet you deny what I say?"

    JW Man: "The individuals that decide to do that on their own are wrong.
    They should not do that."

    (I noticed that he really didn't understand. He must not have been clear
    on the idea of shunning or was possibly fairly new to the religion. I no
    longer thought he was lying, but was just ignorant.)

    OTWO: "It's in the rules. When a member is disfellowshipped or disassociated,
    the Witnesses, including family, should stop associating with him. That means
    shunning- not talking to him anymore."

    JW Boy: "That wouldn't happen to me, anyway. I made my dedication to God
    and won't decide to leave."

    OTWO: "You are baptized already?"

    JW Boy: "Yes."

    OTWO: "Well, then I'm too late. You are stuck. You don't know what you will
    want to do with your life or what 'truth' you will discover as you get older.
    But you will learn that what I said is true, you cannot leave without family
    shunning you."

    JW Man: "Maybe you have us confused with someone else. We don't do that."

    OTWO: "No confusion, you are Jehovah's Witnesses. It's in your teachings.
    It's in your elder's rule book. If you don't shun the disfellowshipped and
    disassociated ones, you can be thrown out and shunned yourself."

    JW Man: "This is not so."

    OWTO: "Okay, it IS so. I have been here long enough. I clearly know more
    about this than you."

    JW Man: "You must be misinformed."

    (Now we are walking away) OTWO: "No, I was an elder in a congregation of
    Jehovah's Witnesses. I had the rule book. I know the rules. Young man,
    you will read it for yourself one day. It's not just in the rulebook, but it's
    available in your WT-library. Good day.

  • new light
    new light

    That's a pretty intense encounter, considering you may have changed the direction of the young man's life, and possibly the older one as well. I am still waiting for my chance to do this. A month ago I was working in a house and some JWs were walking the street. Adrenaline started to flow as I thought of what I was going to say. Five minutes later, I looked outside to see that they had left without even knocking on the door, but had left a lame brochure with an invitation to the local DC "public address". Easy day for them, I guess.

    Good job giving these guys some actual truth.

  • Little Imp
    Little Imp

    Well said OTWO

    LI

  • Aussie Oz
    Aussie Oz

    Powerful encounter!

    hope they both go and do some 'personal study'

    feel sorry for the boy, not so much for the ignorant (lying?) adult, a little, but not much...

    oz

  • chickpea
    chickpea

    at the very least they went running to their elders
    and then got to watch the elders do a song and
    dance about evil apostates, loving arrangements,
    and yada yada yada....

    but what has been heard cannot be unheard!
    with apologies to the more famous >>>>>

  • Quandry
    Quandry

    I continue to be amazed.

    Perhaps at the summer convention, they just weren't clear enough on the df issue. How do some just "not get it?"

    Does this man truly believe that it is not true that disfellowshipping equals shunning? Then what is it?

    I wonder what his explanation of being disfellowshipped is? Or how to treat a df'd person according to the WTS?

    At any rate, what you said will always be in the back of the mind of these two.

    Good job.

  • CuriousButterfly
    CuriousButterfly

    QUOTE: JW Man: "People don't shun their own family members."

    That is bull. While in my family we did not shun most I know do, which is so sad. It makes me sick to see minors get baptized at such a young age.

  • sherah
    sherah

    OTWO, that was a powerful encounter one that they will never forget. It will eat away at them until they look up some information on it.

    Quandry -Perhaps at the summer convention, they just weren't clear enough on the df issue. How do some just "not get it?"
    Does this man truly believe that it is not true that disfellowshipping equals shunning?

    I was thinking this as well. For many dubs, the DF arrangement is a 'loving provision' from jehovah. Shunning is a hateful dictate practiced by false religion. They don't think that they are one in the same even though their new rule book and countless examples at the latest assemblies tell otherwise.

    Most dubs are inconsistent in shunning with their DF family members.

  • baltar447
    baltar447

    Wow, what's with the education of JWs today with their own beliefs? When I was his age, I would have at least had a good defense prepared for the DF'ing arrangement. I guess that's what you get when all the literature is dumbed down. Also, hasn't it been discussed recently that the hispanic culture has a harder time with the DF'ing arrangement?

  • BluesBrother
    BluesBrother

    Didn't The Eagles sing a song that said "You can check out any Time you want, but you can never ever leave"?

    In dubland, if a person fades and just stops doing it, he is a "lost sheep" and encouraged back. But when he adopts a normal life style that goes with his disbelief, even as harmless as a birthday present ....he is in danger of d/f or termed d/a. When that happens he is surely shunned.

    If you have lax elders or canny relatives who want to talk to you after some years away, so they keep quiet, you might get away with it.but???

    BTW..A good, quick thinking encounter OTWO

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