by whereami 38 Replies latest jw friends
belivingxjw:
How do animals that reproduce sexually pass down a gene they have individually developed through mutations and which provide a natural selection advantage?
"It is not necessary for both partners to share the same mutation for it to get passed on. The advantageous allele only needs to be dominant."
(This is the answer given to me by someone I asked about it. I'm hoping that this person will join the thread. In the meantime, I wanted to provide their answer.)
I have learned nothing on this thread and neither have you - which pretty much solidifies my point - debates on this subject are pointless, they very rarely, if ever change someone's pre-position.
Not true at all. I learned that you don't understand biology, chemistry, genetics, don't want to learn them. As you said, you have a pre-decided upon position. I USED to be a good JW and firmly believed in creation. As I got older however, and learned and read more, that view slowly changed in my late teens and 20's. I changed my view via reading and education.
And it is not about taking some easy route because I maintain my own beliefs.
To believe the eye evolved without intelligent input - now thats far from easy....
I know. Biology, genetics, chemistry, archeology....those are hard. Understanding them, learning them. Hard. God did it....that's easy. It's...comfortable.
LWT,
"It is not necessary for both partners to share the same mutation for it to get passed on. The advantageous allele only needs to be dominant."
That would mean then that animal A who had the mutation of, let us say, the light-sensitive cell with the added concave feature (some believe may have occurred) would have mated with animal B who had inherited the light-sensitive cell (without the new concave feature) and thus each shared a corresponding gene in the DNA but the allele variant of the new gene possibly being dominant would pass itself down to the offspring. Okay that for now, and for me, makes sense if I'm understanding it correctly.
The question that could be asked of course is: are most mutations dominant? And also, with the complexities of survival in the natural world being what they are it would seem that hundreds of animals with the new variant would have to survive in order to ensure the survival of the concave feature, let us say, which in itself may not have been necessary for survival at that early stage.
I'm not a creationist who believes the Bible's creation story should be understood literally. It was written at a time when discussions such as this one could not be had and so the simplicity. Much like the simple terms a young father and mother may use to answer their small child's questions on how they came to be. Most parents don't get out the biology books and discuss reproduction and genetics, no, simple terms, truthful, but simple terms, suffice until the child is a little older to understand better. I believe the creation story is just that.
I truly appreciate your responses and through them I hope to learn more and move forward toward understanding. You have opened a door and I will walk through it knowing that truth as Jesus taught makes us free. Thank you.
Not true at all. I learned that you don't understand biology, chemistry, genetics, don't want to learn them.
Ah - now comes the arrogance. You nothing of me or about me. I do not need to have full understanding of biology, chemistry etc to believe that someone / something made/designed the human eye.
Just like I do not need to understand the full mechanics / details of how my 10 megepixel camera works to KNOW that someone (or a group of people) designed and built it.
God did it....that's easy. It's...comfortable.
Easy??? - do you think so??? I don't think its easy at all. I did not mention God - I merely stated that intelligence existed before the eye did - but your probably right - it probably was God....
scotsman - based on the hypothesis God made the eye, is it then possible to formulate any non-trivial predictions that can be verified?
Also, can you explain why it is important for you evolution encompass an element of randomness? do you think this make evolution less likely and if so, why?
it would seem that hundreds of animals with the new variant would have to survive in order to ensure the survival of the concave feature, let us say, which in itself may not have been necessary for survival at that early stage. - believingexjw
Remember we are not talking about the sudden appearance of a concave retina. If a mutation confers even the slightest advantage on its host then it has a good chance of prospering in the gene pool. Don't think in terms of big leaps in development but of tiny, almost imperceptible steps.
Thanks for the insight on that Cofty.
believingxjw:
Cofty is my go-to person on this topic, so I'm glad that he has arrived. (There are a number of other members here who are very well-read, too.) I've barely scratched the surface. I enjoy these discussions.
Ah - now comes the arrogance. You nothing of me or about me. I do not need to have full understanding of biology, chemistry etc to believe that someone / something made/designed the human eye.
Exactly. Ignorance and lack of learning requires zero effort. It's not arrogance to realize when someone has had zero education on a subject. It's experience.
Just like I do not need to understand the full mechanics / details of how my 10 megepixel camera works to KNOW that someone (or a group of people) designed and built it.
You can go to the website and download the specs. Does god have similiar website? No? why not?
Easy??? - do you think so??? I don't think its easy at all. I did not mention God - I merely stated that intelligence existed before the eye did - but your probably right - it probably was God...
Yes, ignorance and lack of learning is the easy way. And what you are stating is on the merest side, lacking in education or critical thinking. Glad we agree on that.
