I'm an ABSENTHEIST. Are you also? (page 6)

prologos

apatheist? good one! but even if the creator (I see his works) is now absent , -I still like to be in recognition, have no qualms about saying "thanks", I am not apathetic, I am a deist.

Their God existed indeed and it was there in the sky for everyone to see. If you don't agree with them about their God's ability to interact with them, that's a matter of opinion. If the point is debating existence, I say their God did indeed exist, and there is evidence to back it up.

However, Cofty, you're resorting to your usual strawman fallacy here. The point of absentheism isn't asserting the existence or non-existence of deities. It simply is asserting that the only thing that we can confidently say about them - and back it up with evidence - is that they're absent. If you want to do your tired number of grandiose claims that God doesn't exist, then be prepared to provide overwhelming evidence for it. The kind of evidence you usually demand from theists.

Eden

cofty

Their God existed indeed and it was there in the sky for everyone to see

No. The sun was there for everybody to see. Their god was a personal being who could hear their hymns and prayers. Their god did not exist.

You lied about Aten. Why?

Egyptians made all sorts of extravagant claims about Aten. All of them demonstrably false.

the only thing that we can confidently say about them - and back it up with evidence - is that they're absent.

This is like saying "the only thing that we can confidently say about pixies - and back it up with evidence - is that they're invisible."

fukitol

Try agreeing on the definition of 'absent' first.

All standard dictionary definitions of 'absent' presuppose there is something that first exists to be absent.

cofty

Eden doesn't believe in definitions. That way you can never be wrong.

EdenOne

Galaxie,

Of course I understand your critique, but to say "god is absent" is not the same thing as "god exists but is absent". The first is open to God's existence or lack thereof. Whomever or whatever God may be, we cannot find evidence at the present time. And that is all we can say about it - unlike atheism, that makes a grandiose claim about the existence of God that is at least (if not more) extravagant claim than theism. Because theism claims that "something", albeit wrong, is evidence in favor of God, while atheism claims that "nothing" is evidence against God.

The example of the sun-god is an anedoctical example given to satisfy Cofty's demand for a definition of God, which he claimed he could deconstruct. When I gave the example, he couldn't refute the evidence that the sun does indeed exist and has been worshipped for its face value - a source of heath, light and nourishment for life. Of course, this is NOT the type of God that Cofty is used to defy. This one really exists. it's there in the sky. Does it do what the Egyptians credit it for? Doesn't matter. It still exists and it is a deity for those who worshipped it.

Eden

cofty

This one really exists

Nope.

Its like you don't actually read a single word anybody writes.

The sun exists.

Aten was a personal god who heard the prayers, and responded to the rituals of Egyptians.

The two things are NOT the same.

to say "god is absent" is not the same thing as "god exists but is absent"

To be absent presupposes existence. You have tried to failed to avoid this most fundamental point of logic.

Sticking your fingers in your ears and singing loudly won't do.

EdenOne

Invisible isn't the same as absent. Strawman again.

As for a definition of "absent": something for which no evidence of presence has been found.

My problem is that atheism purposedly mistakes lack of evidence for evidence of non-existence. No research broad enough has been made of the entire universe and all physical dimentions that can soundly conclude that "No deities exist". That's why it is such an extraordinary claim that relies simply on probability. The simplest explanation that is grounded on reality is: "The only thing that can be said about God is that it's absent".

Eden

cofty

As for a definition of "absent": something for which no evidence of presence has been found.

Please link to your source for that definition. Thanks.

EdenOne

No, Cofty, it is you who can't read what I write and keep resorting to strawman fallacy.

Aten was a sun-god without human traits or antropomorphic qualities. It was there in the sky for everyone to verify. It doesn't matter if you or I agree if Aten could hear hymns or be placated. That's not the point. The sun didn't just represent an invisible being in the spiritual realm called Aten. The sun was Aten. And the sun exists. So too Aten exists. Just because you don't agree with one definition of what constitutes a deity, doesn't force reality to oblige with your wishful thinking.

Eden

I'm an ABSENTHEIST. Are you also?

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