CO refused to take money. And gave me "new light".

by DagothUr 13 Replies latest jw friends

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  DagothUr

  I'm an ex JW from Romania and living in an area where our CO was a young italian guy by the name of R.B. So one day he visited our congregation. It was just after the new light on "this generation", somewhere in may 2010 if I recall correctly. I wanted badly to ask him "The number of the remnant should logically decrease as we get closer to Armageddon. Then why the Annual reports indicate an increase of those partaking the emblems?". It was just pure curiosity, no malice involved.

  So, when the morning meeting was over, I asked to have a private word with him. Before asking the aforementioned question, I took out of my wallet 30 RON (about 8 Euro...not much but enough for 8 litres of gas at that time) and asked him to receive them as a gift. His reaction was: "Oh, no, keep them. You may need them more than I do". So I insisted. And he rejected me again. I insisted a third time, with more obstinacy. This time e took the money timidly and thanked me. Then we discussed the issues of the increase in the number of partakers and the "new light" on "this generation" and he served me the official WT doctrine on those matters:

  1. The number of partakers incresed possibly because of 2 causes. First, Jehovah probably decided that the world-fellowship would need a substantial number of annointed in order to insure a safe passage of the "sheep" through Armageddon (like they were some sort of spiritual guardians watching for the welfare of the flock and serving them the spiritual food until reaching the New System). And maybe the number 144.000 was not quite as filled as we thought and maybe the sealing of the 144.000 was not quite over yet. The second possible reason could be the increase in prozelites coming from mainstream christianity which were used with partaking in their ex-churches and thought they were entitled to do so in the JW congregation also. But these persons were not that numerous.

  2. The new light on the generation issue was linked with the previous explanation. Jehovah is wise and ingenious and can make "adjustments" in his arrangements and in the understanding of the Bible if it's for the benefit of the flock. Armageddon will be a tremendously hard gate and we need strong spiritual sheperds to guide us, not old people (this was my conclusion from what he said).

  So the decision to expand "this generation" like a piece of chewing gum was put on Jehovah's back. He gave the new light. In the evening of the same day the CO gave the public speech and the issue of "this generation" was further explained. We (the world wide r&f) were those guilty of beeing too impatient and taking rash conclusions from the Bible and from the literature. Yea, like the GB never gave a totally different explanation before! I read it when I was very young in a book with red hard cover "You can live forever in Paradise on Earth". That is the translation of it's title from Romanian.

  Anyway, my question is: Has anyone been refused by the overseer when presented a monetary gift? And on what reasons? Is this a unique experience or not? I still have a sort of simpathy for that overseer, but I don't understand what were his motivations...
• 

  DaCheech

  my mother still gives $$$$/hanshakes to the overbeer.

  anyway, they are company men, and will give any answer to keep you in tow
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  varian

  nice fake : )
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  DagothUr

  Varian, what fake?
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  miseryloveselders

  1. The number of partakers incresed possibly because of 2 causes. First, Jehovah probably decided that the world-fellowship would need a substantial number of annointed in order to insure a safe passage of the "sheep" through Armageddon (like they were some sort of spiritual guardians watching for the welfare of the flock and serving them the spiritual food until reaching the New System). And maybe the number 144.000 was not quite as filled as we thought and maybe the sealing of the 144.000 was not quite over yet. The second possible reason could be the increase in prozelites coming from mainstream christianity which were used with partaking in their ex-churches and thought they were entitled to do so in the JW congregation also. But these persons were not that numerous.

  This one is interesting. So in a sense he's saying the annointed are like the blood splattered doors the Jewish slaves used to differentiate between their homes and that of the Egyptians, saving their first borns. Or even a spin off from the many Egyptians that came along with the Jews after Pharoah freed them. The "other sheep" being represented by the Egyptians, which isn't anything new, they've used that illustration, or "type" before. To believe that the number 144,000 wasn't quite filled seems kinda of illogical. You mean to tell me that for 2000 plus years, there has not been 144,000 Christians worthy? It goes back to what others have stated before, that every other number in Revelation is symbolic, but the 144,000 one literal and specific. The other thing I question, is what you relayed about this number increasing because they would be serving the "other sheep" spiritual food until reaching the Noo Sistum. This doesn't make sense to me either because only a minority of the annointed actually dispense the food. One might make the argument, the "other sheep" are doing more dispensing than the annointed nowadays, considering the makeup of the Writing Department, Bethel, and the Branches in general.
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  sir82

  A CO refusing money?

  In the US, you'd sooner see Nancy Pelosi and Karl Rove dancing a tango in Times Square.

  As regards his explanations, well, within the JW theological structure, it sort of makes sense. Of course, it is also 100% pure unadulterated speculation on his part as well, based on nothing scriptural whatsoever. Then again, when did that consideration ever mean anything to JW leadership?
• 

  designs

  You just have to remember that Russell, Rutherford, Franz were influenced by the doctrine of 'Limited Atonment' or 'Particular Redemption' plus the idea of a Christian Levitical Priesthood, remember your Bible lesson where the Levite Priests wade into the Jordan River and they make it possible for the people to cross through to the Promised Land. Everytime you read a Watchtower article on the 144,000 that is the working model they have in mind.
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  DagothUr

  Both of you are right. But a JW is expected to believe ALL the annointed are responsible for giving the spiritual food to the flock in some mysterious way. It's a sort of superstition among JW. They are supposed to believe the GB is just a representant of the entire annointed class. As if the remnant votes who is in the GB. Of course, this is not the case, but if you ask a JW "how does a GB member gain this title?" they will be blocked. In theory, the GB uses the entire annointed class and the large crowd to dissipate the guilt for all their mistakes and foul play. And yes, within JW theology it all makes perfect sense. But JW theology was never too scriptural, was it?

  And yes again...that was exactly what he wanted to say: most of the 144.000 seem to live in the end-days period.
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  DagothUr

  Refusing monetary gifts is something not encouraged by the JW doctrine. If someone wants to give you something, you should take it and be thankful. I don't say this is good or bad, scriptural or not. I just want to know if someone else was refused by the overseer. The name of the person in question is r.o.b.e.r.t.o.b.a.l.d.o. Does anyone know him more closely?
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  designs

  DagothUr-

  The Watchtower has never functioned where all of the Anointed contribute to the teaching staff. Again use the Levites as the example, the family of Aaron was the teaching staff and the other priests were officiates. Its similar in the Catholic religion where you have the College of Cardinals and the Doctrine of Faith, only a inner circle of priests, Cardinals, determine doctrine and dogma the others officiate.