Shackled to the Watchtower: A distinction every Jehovah's Witness should acknowledge

by Nickolas 49 Replies latest jw friends

  • Ding
    Ding

    I'm glad those verses in John 6 have been effective for you.

    I've shared them with several JWs to no effect.

    They've told me that's only for the 144,000 because the WTS says so and the WTS is God's organization.

    When I asked earlier how we can connect with JWs who have doubts, what I meant was how do we identify them?

    If you start spreading non-WT questions or teachings indiscriminately at the KH, you'll be outed and ostracized so fast you won't have time to connect with the people who are really open.

  • AGuest
    AGuest

    I understand, dear Ding (again, peace to you!). Emphasizing the words "anyone"... "unless"... "live forever"... no life in yourselves"... and "resurrect" seems to work for me/us (my husband and I)... especially when you ask them what they believe those words mean in light of what Christ is recorded as saying. But I understand what you're saying.

    Peace to you!

    A slave of Christ,

    SA

  • serenitynow!
    serenitynow!

    I don't know. Do you really feel there are that many people in the org, who know what it really is? I would say for myself, and for others that I knew at the KH, it is ignorance that keeps many there, not fear. I didn't know enough to have fear. I didn't know enough to do independent research on the JWs. I was a born-in, and had no reason to believe that the religion that my entire family embraced was a cult.

    Since I learned the "truth" I have not gone into a KH. I will only go for the funeral of a person I care about.

  • GrandmaJones
    GrandmaJones

    I am thinking upon reading these posts, about what I've learned from the "cult mindcontrol" type books. There is a type of conversation, (and it usually doesn't last too long before the "wall" comes back up) where, for a moment, just the slightest moment, that two members who are having a rare moment of intimacy, and whose guards are slightly down, say just enough to jolt each other into awareness. A spark of llight, then fear, then the wall. Two "authentic" personalities together at the same moment in time.

    At a family gathering of my JW family a couple of months ago, we were all chatting comfortably, and I happened to mention that Jesus is not our mediator. Just sort of tossed it off as part of the conversation. I looked up and one of my cousins was staring at me quite intently. She wanted to know why I said that. (She too has been in the "truth" for many decades, another born-in) I just gave an easy laugh and said that it's what we teach. I kind of explained. She stayed serious, continued to look at me, then asked me to send her information on where that statement can be found.

    It was a moment of truth.

    It's a chink in her wall.

  • bobld
    bobld

    You got that right mr.Nick.That is way we don't put any effort to sucker in any new slaves for the two faced Monsters.

    B

  • LUKEWARM
    LUKEWARM

    When I asked earlier how we can connect with JWs who have doubts, what I meant was how do we identify them?
    If you start spreading non-WT questions or teachings indiscriminately at the KH, you'll be outed and ostracized so fast you won't have time to connect with the people who are really open.

    IMHO seek opportunities to introduce thoughts - don’t challenge them in any way just make the conversation about you – but time is the issue and the lack of motivation to be on the worthless JW treadmill of works seeking these opportunities… Here is what has worked a treat for me: (1) Be known as a reasonable and open minded individual. Don’t come across as “this is right and this is wrong” kind of thinking. You’re a person that understands that there are plenty shades of grey

    (2) Have several one on one conversations with individuals to identify where there head space is at – in the process make people feel comfortable in your presence – dignify them, seek their opinions etc

    (3) After several conversations, create an opportunity to introduce a thought or 2 from that “householder or relative who asked you a question”, a question you were embarrassed with as you had no answer for - eg they asked you" "were you not preaching a few years ago that the 1914 generation wont die out before the end" or "why was your organization involved with the UN?" etc

    (4) Tell them you then did research on the subject and ….(in the case of the UN, the matter checks out on the UN website, on the generations our thinking has changed 5 times already…)

    (5) Let them know that you enjoy when people challenge your thinking because over time you have needed to change the way you think to become more “balanced”.

    (6) See where the conversation goes – and if they open up with anything. Seek to build on that next time around…

    (7) Patience is a must as they can only take small doses of this stuff. Resist your eagerness to share learning's and convey information too quickly which has the propensity to backfire. Taking things slowly is the key - but there are no guarantees (8) It takes many different subtle comments over a long period of time to chip away at the mind control and encourage Witnesses to think for themselves and stop just parroting the official WTS line. Once they are in a position to do so, then material can be introduced that can educate and truly liberate them... The ones I talk to see many of the issues but all the negatives have not stacked up yet for them to view the organization as useless.

    Its impossible to convince others - they will have to make that voyage of discovery themselves - and this is where I feel I can assist to provide info that I found interesting. I'm hoping that this information can help to accelerate their learnings and awareness so they can make informed decissions...

    .

  • JunkYardDog
    JunkYardDog

    Nickolas: You seem like a smart guy? your learning about the facts of the wt after 33 years of them kicking you in the ass and now your looking for answers? "to slam dunk" them and save your wife. Well those jw's you want to be so nice to and try to reason with will kick your spritual ass and TAKE YOUR WIFE FROM YOU. IF THEY CATCH WIND , YOUR TRYING TO GET YOUR WIFE OUT OF THE WTS. THEY WILL GANG UP ON YOU JUST LIKE THE HELLS ANGELS. would kick your ass for calling them fagots. the wts does the same thing without the knives and bats and black eyes, broken bones Your wounds will heal from a broken leg or fat lip. The wounds of a x jw being shunned for life will NEVER HEAL. I.ve been reading your posts and your ready in some way to stand up to the wt. even to the point you said " I will muster all my energy to fight them" Based on your posts I've read and your demeanor , the jw's will eat you up in 5 minutes and spit you out as easy work. AND TAKE YOUR WIFE AWAY iF YOU CONFRONT THEM. you just don't have the knowledge and the nerve to hang , when you ask your wife hard questions and she brings the elders over to shut you down. but I'll give you credit your trying to learn I know you don't like my tactics (and that's ok) I have experence dealing with jw's and when they run you over like THE HELLS ANGELS you will have wished they only broken your leg... the wts will break your heart. Nickolas ; you bitched about that XJW that went to the kingdom hall and REAMED OUT a few jw's, If you don't keep your mouth shut you may be doing the same thing on youtube next year. good luck to your wife and you. the wt exposer

  • Black Sheep
    Black Sheep

    When your Dub gives you the opportunity, point out that because of the psychological warfare they inflict on their members through threats of shunning by their close family members, they can never know if the speaker on the platform is a true believing Dubby or an Apostate ........ and it makes no difference if it is a 6 year old giving their first talk or a visiting speaker from Crooklyn.

  • WTWizard
    WTWizard

    And they do this on purpose. Children are not allowed to do anything in school that might make them independent of the witlesses. They are trained to pio-sneer or go to Beth Hell, not work. They are threatened with destruction if they do not obey. Everything outside is "from Satan". They are dragged to boasting sessions, and pressured to get baptized at age 6 (some make it to their teens, but too many get baptized in their single digits).

    Then, once they realize the death threats are a scam, the threat becomes being disinherited. Their livelihoods are in the cancer. Their whole social network is in the cancer, because the world is "from Satan". Their families are loyal to the cancer, not the family. If they leave, or even express doubt about a minor issue, they are cut off. Even recruited witlesses can fall prey to this, if they fall into the scam of working for a witless or living with a witless (whether as a landslumlord or roommate).

    Not to mention the fear of being hounded to death, which for some is worse than getting disfellowshipped. The witlesses will hound them to death for violations of virtually anything, using "brazen conduct" to force compliance. Even after they are disfellowshipped, they are not always left alone--one outspoken apostate has been hounded all too many times (one might say, once too many) despite repeated warnings to leave him the fxxx alone. And, for those with a few good friends, dorkhood is used to keep them at the Kingdumb Hell.

    From a viewpoint of wanting a strong organization, it would be better to create obvious value. You would want to make people want to be in, and want to stay in by making it enjoyable to be there. While it would still start small, it would build--similar to the disco movement that started back in the mid 1960s and grew slowly until one day, someone incorporated a sample of it in a mainstream song. People liked it, so they began incorporating more disco into mainstream music. Not long after, disco became mainstream and eventually dominated. It eventually fell because too many people having no business making disco music started cashing in on it, making crap "disco" that barely qualifies as music (let alone as disco), and people got tired of that. To this day, good disco music still sells.

    If a religion (or God) really wanted more power, it (or he) should have made the religion as much fun as disco music was in its day (and still is, for those unburing Daddy's old disco music). I don't think people need to be held hostage to something that is that much fun. By the way, disco still sells, despite listeners defecting to country, slow jams, soft rock, and hard rock/heavy metal. (And a good religion should survive despite its members going to other religions for a time.)

  • leavingwt
    leavingwt
    the practice of disfellowshipping and shunning is causing the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society to rot from within

    Absolutely. This, combined with a dose of Stockholm Syndrom, adequately describes the WT turd referred to as a 'Spiritual Paradise' by indoctrinated members.

    Get busy living or get busy dying. Everything this cult touches turns to $hit and rolls downhill.

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