by WSEV12 14 Replies latest jw experiences
I am still trying to find my spiritual path and am not sure if the JW is the right path for me. I do like the presentation at the kingdom hall and the magazines, but feel that many of my views might conflict with JW doctrine. I would prefer not to recite specific differences here. Should I still attend the meetings? I am nervous that they will expect me to believe the same things as they do.
-William
I am nervous that they will expect me to believe the same things as they do.
WSEV12........welcome to the forum and Merry Christmas. The JW's will appease you for as long as they can until they can get you committed to joining, but ultimately you will have to outwardly believe 100% current WTS expoused doctine. That's the deal. Chose wisely.
Think About It
WELCOME!
You're right to be nervous. Go with what your gut is telling you.
Watchtower, 2001, 8/1, p. 14, par. 8, Make Your Advancement Manifest
First, since "oneness" is to be observed, a mature Christian must be in unity and full harmony with fellow believers as far as faith and knowledge are concerned. He does not advocate or insist on personal opinions or harbor private ideas when it comes to Bible understanding. Rather, he has complete confidence in the truth as it is revealed by Jehovah God through his Son, Jesus Christ, and "the faithful and discreet slave." By regularly taking in the spiritual food provided "at the proper time"-through Christian publications, meetings, assemblies, and conventions-we can be sure that we maintain "oneness" with fellow Christians in faith and knowledge.-Matthew 24:45.
And you are free to voice your misgivings here. You may just find that many will agree with your 'divergent' views.
Season's Greetings!
WSEV12: The short answer is that as long as you are not baptized, you are allowed to have your own views. After you are baptized, you are expected to keep dissenting views more or less to yourself, and you can only talk about them in a limited way. Many here have been kicked out and lost contact to family and friends simply because they had a different oppinion.
Here is an excerpt from a trial some years back where one of their leaders discuss the importance of unity in belief:
http://www.forananswer.org/Top_JW/WalshTrial.htm
Q. Is it not vital to speak the truth on religious matters?
A. It certainly is.
Q. Is there in your view room in a religion for a change of interpretation of Holy Writ from time to time?
A. There is every reason for a change in interpretation as we view it, of the Bible. Our view becomes more clear as we see the prophesy fulfilled by time.
Q. You have promulgated -- forgive the word -- false prophesy?
A. We have -- I do not think we have promulgated false prophesy, there have been statements that were erroneous, that is the way I put it, and mistaken.
Q. Is it a most vital consideration in the present situation of the world to know if the prophesy can be interpreted into terms of fact, when Christ's Second Coming was?
A. That is true, and we have always striven to see that we have the truth before we utter it. We go on the very best information we have but we cannot wait until we get perfect, because if we wait until we get perfect we would never be able to speak.
Q. Let us follow that up just a little. It was promulgated as a matter which must be believed by all members of Jehovah's Witnesses that the Lord's Second Coming took place in 1874?
A. I am not familiar with that. You are speaking on a matter that I know nothing of.
Q. You heard Mr. Franz's evidence?
A. I heard Mr. Franz testify, but I am not familiar with what he said on that, I mean the subject matter of what he was talking about, so I cannot answer any more than you can, having heard what he said.
Q. Leave me out of it?
A. That is the source of my information, what I have heard in court.
Q. You have studied the literature of your movement?
A. Yes, but not all of it. I have not studied the seven volumes of "Studies in the Scriptures," and I have not studied this matter that you are mentioning now of 1874. I am not at all familiar with that.
Q. Assume from me that it was promulgated as authoritative by the Society that Christ's Second Coming was in 1874?
A. Taking that assumption as a fact, it is a hypothetical statement.
Q. That was the publication of false prophesy?
A. That was the publication of a false prophesy, it was a false statement or an erronious statement in fulfilment of a prophesy that was false or erroneous.
Q. And that had to be believed by the whole of Jehovah's Witnesses?
A. Yes, because you must understand we must have unity, we cannot have disunity with a lot of people going every way, an army is supposed to march in step.
Q. You do not believe in the worldly armies, do you?
A. We believe in the Christian Army of God.
Q. Do you believe in the worldly armies?
A. We have nothing to say about that, we do not preach against them, we merely say that the worldly armies, like the nations of the world today, are a part of Satan's Organization, and we do not take part in them, but we do not say the nations cannot have their armies, we do not preach against warfare, we are merely claiming our exemption from it, that is all.
Q. Back to the point now. A false prophesy was promulgated?
A. I agree that.
Q. It had to be accepted by Jehovah's Witnesses?
A. That is correct.
Q. If a member of Jehovah's Witnesses took the view himself that that prophesy was wrong and said so he would be disfellowshipped?
A.Yes, if he said so and kept persisting in creating trouble, because if the whole organisation believes one thing, even though it be erronious and somebody else starts on his own trying to put his ideas across then there is disunity and trouble, there cannot be harmony, there cannot be marching. When a change comes it should come from the proper source, the head of the organisation, the governing body, not from the bottom upwards, because everybody would have ideas, and the organisation would disintegrate and go in a thousand different directions. Our purpose is to have unity.
Q. Unity at all costs?
A. Unity at all costs, because we believe and are sure that Jehovah God is using our organisation, the governing body of our organisation to direct it, even though mistakes are made from time to time.
Q. And unity based upon an enforced acceptance of false prophecy?
A. That is conceded to be true.
Q. And the person who expressed his view, as you say, that it was wrong, and was disfellowshipped, would be in breach of the Covenant, if he was baptized?
A. That is correct.
Q. And as you said yesterday expressly, would be worthy of death?
A. I think - - -
Q. Would you say yes or no?
A. I will answer yes, unhesitatingly.
Q. Do you call that religion?
A. It certainly is.
Q. Do you call it Christianity?
A. I certainly do.
You can also see how the Watchtower answer questions form its own members in various correspondences with the watchtower:
http://www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk/blood_-_jensen_letters.html
you can make up your own mind as to how interested they are in an actual dialogue, and how much they just want the members to agree with them.
On a personal note, i can add that my girlfriend lost all her "active" friends the moment she began to show a lack of interest in what they was teaching.
WSEV12.A very big welcome!!!!!Well they will expect you to believe & DO all they tell you to do
I was one for 25 years a FAITHFUL one. But I couldnt believe Jesus came invisably in 1914
so the disfellowshipped me. So if you want to do as the WT tells you keep going.BUT remember
a few things you MUST obey,like No birhday celebration,no Christmas ,no voting,no oral sex,
no speaking to any one that leaves the oraganization,no Mothers day,no Fathers day,no praying.
to Jesus( by the way HE is the ONLY WAY! TRUTH<to get LIFE.)only at the end of the prayer
You MUST attend all meetings, go from door to door or telephone people, count time,
tell them how many mags you placed to whom.how many books you placed how many hours you
spent in "service" many,many more .But the GOD who created all in MY opinion ,tells me
not by works it is by FAITH you will be saved .So my friend if you want to be a JW go for it!
ME???? I will let my Faith help me through this very difficult world.
You asked I answered But It is GREAT to have you here (((HUG)))
Welcome, William:
The short answer, as so many here have already said, is yes, you will be expected to believe 100% of what JWs teach. This is not an organization that tolerates questions from its baptized members, and quickly labels any such questioning as "murmuring," "complaining," and "rebelling." This is a high-control, strictly hierarchial organization that governs from the top down, and as ordinary rank-and-file publishers, the vast majority of JWs, including ALL women, are expected to obey without questioning. In order to maintain such tight control, information is strictly controlled and members are strongly discouraged from purusing much in the way of third-party research, such research being viewed as coming from Satan's world. Unless, of course, it happens to correlate with JW doctrine, and then it's seen as proof of the "Truth."
I am baptized, born-in, and currently inactive, as my conscience does not allow me to promulgate ideas I knew to be incorrect. Best wishes to you and please keep us up to date on how things go...
Welcome! It is nice to have you here.
In short, once someone has decided to get baptized and officially become a Jehovah's Witness, they are asked a series of jw doctrinal questions. You must agree to these. If you agree, you will be "eligible" for baptism. If you later disagree, and are vocal about it, you could be disfellowshipped (excommunicated) as in Mouthy's case. You will always be in subjection to the watchtowers interpetation of scripture.
Have a blessed Day!
Listen to your "red flag" gut concerns. Don't get baptized as a JW. They will "love-bomb" you till then. You would then have to vow to the organization to be loyal and agreeable 100%.
Please research the "full" facts. Read Crisis of Conscience by Ray Franz. Stay on this site for awhile. Check other sites like jwfacts.com and freeminds.org.
Welcome to the forum. The JW religion holds two sets of rules: one set for the "outsiders" and another set for the "baptised."
The organization is more tolerant with the outsiders. Once you are baptised, there is no way out, you must tow the JW line. The elders will disfellowship you if they see any doubt or dissension. They expect perfection from imperfect humans. One "in" you can never do enough for the organization...more money, more service, more loyalty. The loyalty is not to God, but to the Watchtower organization.
The WT organization is about "religion" rather than "spirituality." It is about following a set of rigid rules, rather than following your own internal conscience.
Please be careful making your decision. Don't be fooled by the "love-bombing" and don't be fooled by emotion. Learn the facts. Love-bombing ends once you are baptised.
Be open to the criticism you hear because that comes from having experienced the inner cogs of the WT organization.
I suggest you read "Crisis of Conscience" by Raymond Franz. That book will provide an inside view of how the organization is really run at the top.
Best,
ESTEE
Do you totally understand what "disfellowshipping" means? It means that no one in the organization will talk to you, even to say hello, and will avert their eyes when meeting you on the street and in public. If you marry or have children and leave, if they are "in the truth" they will behave in the same way. Families are divided, marriages ruined, and the relationships between parent and child can get really ugly. They don't talk to you about disfellowshipping right away, do they? You can't get in any new converts if you tell too soon. Expect them to act like it is no big deal and merely a way to "keep the organization clean". It's a horrible method of discipline. In order to end it, you must write a humble "begging" letter to your judicial committee and MAYBE they will have you sit in meetings with everyone else not looking at and not talking to you for six months to a year. Then, MAYBE they will let you back if you act like you will never again disagree or believe anything they don't tell you believe.
Did they tell you this?
