by behemot 22 Replies latest watchtower medical
When, OH WHEN !!! will the WT get their frealing head out of their ass and AT LEAST make the blood transfusion thing a matter of personal consience and ONLY prohibt the EATING of Blood ( if they are so inclined to follow Levitical Law).
Jeez, seriously, it doesn't take much common sense to see how WRONG their no-blood policy is.
Hey black sheep that's a really good point. Independant research has shown that, as you say only one out of three witnesses brought up in the faith will stay with it.
That means of course that most kids not given blood and died would actually not have stayed in the JW org.
That's quite a sobering thought, and one we should remind witnesses about when we have any contact with them.
There is much publicity surrounding this isolated incident. The questions I had regarding this incident are,
Was a transfusion the only alternative, or was that the only alternative that this particular hospital was aware of? If the baby was in a facility such as in the United States Englewood, NJ Bloodless Center, would the technology and expertise of the medical staff there have been sufficient to save the baby with equal proficieny? Are there are "life-saving" methods that the particual hospital in Ireland does not yet utilize?
JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES AND BLOOD TRANSFUSIONS
"As of 2006, there are 142 hospitals and over 100,000 doctors in the United States that offer some version of bloodless treatment to all patients regardless of religious beliefs. (See "Blood Conservation Strategies" on page 28)". http://www.knocking.org
Good questions johnwscott. Information is limited and I suppose you can only trust the judgement of the clinicians in this case.
" Consultant Dr Kevin Carson, clinical director of intensive care, argued the youngster's life was in danger and there were no medical alternatives to a transfusion. "
As a general point , I think we have to make a distinction that the WTBTS often blurs. In cases of elective adult surgery there are often alternatives , some of which may be acceptable to some JWs (eg cellsavers etc) and some of which may even be superior to transfusion , especially in medical centres of excellence as you have described. But in cases of catastrophic major blood loss (such as an accident or rupture during pregnancy) or in cases involving very young infants there really is no alternative. That is very hard for a JW to accept , as they have been taught that the "worldly" medical establishment will invariably come up with a solution.
The ethical question also arises as to whether it is acceptable that a parent should be prepared for a child to die on the basis of their beliefs which may or not be shared by the the child when they grow older and may well be subject to change by the ( usually childless) religious leaders who legislated. My JW parents have said that they would have been prepared to let me die for the want of a kidney or heart transplant when these were disfellowshipping cases pre the change of WTBTS policy in 1980. Would that have been fair or right? As a result , although we were active JWs and I served as an elder , my wife & I always refused to fill in a childs blood card for our children. I know many JW parents who take the same view.
''If the baby was in a facility such as in the United States Englewood, NJ Bloodless Center, would the technology and expertise of the medical staff there have been sufficient to save the baby with equal proficieny?''
Yes, that would have been great, but unfortunately the child was, according to Google Earth, about 3,180 miles away at the time.
JohnWScott
a precious life has been saved here by the disgusting murderous policy of your organization's obsession with an unscriptural doctrine on this policy, this policy was implemented when Knorr and Fred Franz were at the death bed of your second president Judge Rutherford an egotistical ,drunk,sexist crook , and these 2 promised him to implement this policy he dreamt up after his previous vaccination ban that saw countless more lives lost, the evil snooping bastards that perform death bed disfellowshippings are no better the all of your Governing Body members who kept quiet over many decades and watched ten of thousands of lives lost adhering to this policy thinking they were pleasing your bastard God, hell fire and eternal punishments awaits these crooks/paedophiles that died enforcing this.
You ever watched a loved one die a slow and excruciating death from not accepting a blood transfusion John? then quit justifying your organization's policy as your wrote in the 2nd paragraph of your reply, it sucks.
There is much publicity surrounding this isolated incident.
As one who has been monitoring the death of JWs who refuse blood transfusions, I have to ask what qualifies this as an isolated incident? I am afraid that the death of JWs after refusing a blood transfusion is a common occurance- not isolated. Perhaps you missed the story on the Internet that JW women are 6x more likely to die in childbirth from blood loss than non-JW women. Have you looked into the root causes for these deaths and the reasons why 'bloodless" medicine won't work in childbirth? The fact is JWs do accept blood now- but in pieces, not the whole component.
This WT "blood fractions" dogma is likely a compromise the Governing Body reached to satisfy the minority of GB members who wanted to make blood transfusions a total conscience issue for JWs. If only a minority of the GB wanted to do away with the WT no blood transfusions dogma, wouldn't you want to know about it? Why do Jews and Jewish hospitals see not problem with blood transfusions? If the Rabbis see no conflict with their laws, then why should JWs avoid blood transfusions- remember, only the JWs have this no-blood dogma? The WT no-blood dogma is based on the OT Bible laws given to the Jews. A blood transfusion will not save the life of a starving man= blood transfusions are not food for the body and do not violate the Bible laws against eating blood. When blood is shed, by a Red Cross blood donor, for use in a blood transfusion, the life of the donor is not harmed- "shedding blood" in the Bible always equaled with murder or death. This is not the same as donating blood. If the WT is wrong on it's no-blood dogma, then the WT and it's minions have to accept Godly punishment for their blood guilt over the deaths on all JWs who died because of this WT dogma.
It is dangerous for a pregnant JW woman to follow the WT no-blood laws- Has the WT mentioned this statistic?
I think the parents we're releaved after the Judge said that! Now the ''guilt'' is of their shoulders and their child will be saved, they know the child cant do anything about it, as do they. With this in mind they are happy they dont have te take responsibility and explain evertyhing to the elders.
Hopefully the kid will raise healthy, and doesnt become a JW.
What a complex and tragic situation for those parents to be in. They have been robbed of their God-given right to apply reason to their deathly serious dilema.
What makes it even more tragic is that the Blood Policy they are following to their childs death is erroneous:
-Sab
dozy - "The babies parents in this case seem a bit more resigned to the situation , not even bothering to go to the judges house or send a representative from the HLC."
I suspect these days, JWs see the writing on the walls (conciously or otherwise), at least in terms of actions the state will take; most people here are probably aware of the high-profile case in Alberta last decade; i strongly suspect that legal precedents are being made, at least with regards to minors, parental religious beliefs be damned. The developed world is getting more and more secular these days, after all. Maybe the FLDS polygamy cases are having an effect.The thought had ocurred to me, too. When I was still active, there was a deep, hidden part of me that hoped that, if I needed one, the courts would mandate it (both before and after I became a parent - moreso after I became a parent).
medina - "I think the parents we' re releaved after the Judge said that! Now the ''guilt'' is of their shoulders and their child will be saved, they know the child cant do anything about it, as do they. With this in mind they are happy they dont have te take responsibility and explain evertyhing to the elders."
It wouldn't surprise me. When I realized that it was the threat of DFing that I feared, rather than the possibility of pissing of God (assuming He exists), I wasn't the least bit surprised to learn (anecdotally) that the majority of "professed" JWs (hee hee) would probably accept one (at least in an emergency situation) if they thought they could keep it on the down-low.
