Verifiable Former Bethelite Willing to Answer questions

by Uzzah 94 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  MeanMrMustard

  @LongHairGal,

  You wrote:

  MEANMRMUSTARD:

  I also have noticed that there are far TOO many people in the religion who take medication for mental issues. This is NO coincidence. Sadly, many of these people are women. I always felt that the culture and the mentality of the religion and its teachings either causes or aggravates depression.

  In the case of all these women, in some cases it was because the religion held them back from making something of themselves and they are dependent and needy as opposed to being independent and self-sufficient. This kind of insecurity certainly breeds depression - especially when they hit middle-age and their health and good looks are fading and chances of marriage are nil and Armageddon hasn't come yet to save them....They will find they are targeted by "users' like I was. I RAN from these users and my conscience certainly didn't bother me over it. NO SIR. But maybe other deluded JW females might feel it is their lot in life to be doing favors and they might fall for some bull about 'christian personality' meaning they should be a doormat and tolerate every kind of intrusion. This self-sabotaging behavior causes depression.

  It also cannot be ignored that the congregations are hotbeds of trouble and gossiping. The so-called 'friends' are literally devouring each other with gossip and other trouble. It is so bad that some people are compelled to leave their hall and go elsewhere, just for their emotional well-being. Back in the day when I was 'active' in the religion I could not tolerate this. It was at a point that I could not even be in the company of certain people. Believe me, nobody is going to go out of their way to attend a kingdom hall when somebody there is making trouble for them. This was certainly no 'oasis'. Far from it. And all this crap is in addition to everything else that is wrong with the religion. Who the hell needs it? I felt it was more upbuilding to stay home.

  They can take this religion and shove it.

  I too have noticed that there seems to be a higher level of mental illness in JW women than JW men. And I tend to agree a large part of it has to deal with the gossip. Now that my wife and I are out, we look back and wonder why we tolerated the mental games.

  Thanks,

  MeanMrMustard
• 

  MeanMrMustard

  Mental illness. Depression and 'environmental allergies" seem to plague many Witnesses. Bethel is pretty hard on anyone less than 10 years who develop any kind of illness that could prevent them from doing their assignment. Unless of course they are in a prime position such as legal or Service desk overseer or on the Branch Committee (of course).

  I have seen many a single brother and married couple 'encouraged' (read told) to leave. No support financially, just told to go home and hopefully the local congregation will step up to help.

  Uzzah, Thanks for the input. I worry about the mental health of JWs. I feel bad seeing the sheer number of women on anti-depression/anti-anxiety medication. I can't help but think that the percentage of people on meds in the KH is much higher than, say, the church down the road. I have another question. What are all these "underground tunnels" that people are talking about? "Jonny" mentions them... I've read several posts now from ex-Bethelites talking about these tunnels, but nothing in detail.

  Thanks,

  MeanMrMustard
• 

  mochamint22

  Yeah I agree with the points on the mental health. My mom, who's still very much in- regular pioneer- told me that the WT changed things saying that it's ok now to seek that kind of treatment and it's ok to go to a mental health professional whereas before it was frowned upon because you were thought to be putting your faith in man. Maybe it's got to do with all those suicides that keep happening. I know I tried it- in that moment I just figured that I was dead anyway- a walking corpse in my moms direct words to me- so I just figured, why put this off? Let's just get it over with right now. Be done with it all. Yes, this religion does a number, and thats putting it lightly, on one's mental health. Yes the gossip is TERRIBLE. If you're not part of a clique then just forget it! you're nothing, no one. not important. There's even cliques for going out in service. There's nothing worse than being put in a car group and seeing that person's face looking like they don't wanna go with you. LAME.I vividly remember many times I was going door to door ALONE bc I was the third wheel or just didn't wanna be with someone pretending to like me since i wasnt part of their clique. UGH. nauseating...

  moe
• 

  Uzzah

  Mr Mustard: The tunnels are simply underground walkways to get from one building to another. It is primarily for the practical reason of not having to go outside during inclement weather. The more paranoid claim it is for escaping from mobs or protests should they occur but considering they don't go anywhere except other bethel buildings it would be of limited value as an escape plan.

  We did declare the one tunnel at the Canada Branch (between the residence and the office/factory) to be the tornado shelter. It was good for at least that purpose
• 

  minimus

  Uzzah, maybe Rick will invite you on Sixscreens.
• 

  Vidiot

  MeanMrMustard - "What are all these "underground tunnels" that people are talking about?"

  Some of us also have a theory that GB2.0 may be building an underground bunker complex at the new HQ in upstate NY. There's been some third-hand weirdness reported that would fit that hypothesis.

  Metatron makes a fairly compelling case for why the theory might have some merit: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/204576/1/Is-A-Moderate-Opinion-of-the-Governing-Body-Possible
• 

  Billy the Ex-Bethelite

  Uzzah,

  I can't recall exactly the time this would have been, probably mid-90s. The branch in Canada was greatly expanded. Afterward, many of the "skilled" Canadians that had worked up there were transferred down to the US, particularly Patterson, and put to work on the US branch construction projects. For the ones that I encountered, I didn't find that they were specially skilled at all. It didn't make much sense from where I was, and I never got a reasonable explanation for why imported Canadians were brought in when there were already plenty of domestic applicants. What really made it annoying was that some of them brought a "superior attitude" that they were specially chosen by the GB to come "fix problems" in US construction.

  Later, I got some stories that expansion construction up at Canada hadn't gone very well, and at least one of the workers from Canada that I knew was already a known troublemaker when he was sent down. Others of them were nice enough people, but really didn't have any special skills.

  I also heard that most of the expanded factory and residential space that was added, remained vacant because printing didn't increase and more Bethelites were not needed. I assumed that they're printing the ragazines up there since there's plenty of factory and residential space up there that they could never sell.

  added: The structures in Brooklyn Heights couldn't handle the amount of excavation that would be required for any type of bunker. The structures are too old and their are subway tunnels, underground utilities, and a high water table that would make it too dangerous. And it would be pointless to create upstate bunkers. The GB would be much more of the mentality that they would have fake ids and hidden assets to escape to South America from anywhere.
• 

  satinka

  Hi Uzzah,

  I helped write the frickin 1995 Watchtower article about the "Generation Change" and was privvy to all the discussions surrounding that change. I knew of many of the child abuse cases, cover ups and mishandlings. Yet when I said I wanted to leave, they all but drove me to the gate.

  Seems to me the WT thinks they are above reproach, no matter how much covering up of their corruption. This is the fallacy of most religions. Each one thinks they are the only right religion and can do no wrong. Especially true of the Jehovah's Witnesses. They commit perjury via "Theocratic Warfare" thinking that Jehovah is helping them "trick" their religious opponents. They believe that Jehovah would want it that way.

  I believe one day their actions will catch up to them and they will be held accountable by a power greater than themselves or even their false god.

  satinka
• 

  Vidiot

  Billy the Ex-Bethelite - "...it would be pointless to create upstate bunkers. The GB would be much more of the mentality that they would have fake ids and hidden assets to escape to South America from anywhere."

  All right, fair enough; I see your point. Buggering off to SA would be cheaper and easier to plan, definitely. Except...that suggests that on some level, GB2.0 is cognizant that the entire WTS lacks legitimacy and/or is crumbling.

  First, I haven’t heard any rumors about private aircraft or other forms of clandestine emergency transportation to quickly leave the country in.

  Secondly, quite a number of insiders and former insiders, on the other hand, have gone out of their way to stress that GB2.0 are full-on True Believers™ in every sense of the term. I could be wrong, but seems to me that True Believers™ with an increasingly apparent bunker mentality would be more likely to, well, build bunkers.

  I’ve mentioned this before, but I think it bears repeating; it’s theoretically doable at the new upstate HQ.

  They have the billions in assets they could liquidate to finance it, it’s in a semi-rural area where there’s less public scrutiny, and there are literally hundreds of engineering firms and general contractors who would quite happily sign NDAs for any work they consult on (especially if they're well-payed); plus they could get additional engineering done in-house, and they’re able to mix and cast their own concrete on-site if need be.

  If I were a heavy hitter on the GB going what they’re going through this last decade with pedophile settlements, bad PR, and embarrassing Old Light™ coming back with a vengeance, I’d want to build a bunker complex.

  Remember the whole “you may receive some information from the FDS/GB that seems strange or hard to understand, but we strongly suggest you follow it” that they’ve been working into the WT worldview for the past ten-odd years?

  How about a private letter to all the COs (that they can shred afterwords): “Dear brothers: As we have been deep in the Time of the End, the Faithful and Discreet Slave have given the loving direction that, in light of how stressful world conditions and persecution against his faithful servants have become, faithful followers of Jehovah are advised to quickly and quietly pack a few personal effects (no more than one pieve of carry luggage, please), and make your way to the new Watchtower Branch Headquarters in upstate New York. Further loving instructions are forthcoming.”

  Who’d go, besides everyone already there?

  Single brothers and sisters with limited prospects (reduces the need for family-related facilities, and fits with the Bethel mindset about children), a few full-on active local families, and that’s about it, but when you think about it, it's all they'd feel they'd need to ride out the Big A.

  They’d likely view it as a “sifting” work; winnowing out the last of the fence-sitters. Come to think of it, they have mentioned in the occasional publication that "not all Jehovah’s Witnesses may survive The Great Tribulation"; this could easily dovetail with that prediction.

  Is it really so hard to believe?
• 

  fjtoth

  Is there some reason why we are hesitating to label #8 as Aquilla Zook? I believe his wife's name was Virginia. She worked in the sewing room. They were brought into Brooklyn Bethel in the 1950s when the California literature depot was closed down (in San Diego, if I remember correctly). The depot had provided literature for the U.S. west coast from the beginning of WWII when it was thought that general transportation might be cut off from the east coast due to the war. Aquilla walked with a limp and worked somewhere in the "Bethel home," in maintenance, I believe.