JW ADVANTAGES vs DISADVANTAGES

by DesirousOfChange 48 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  144001

  Admit it, at least there is a moral standard among (most of) the Witnesses. It encourages people to avoid things like smoking, drug use, alcohol abuse, "fornicating" and the risk of things associated with that (both physcial and emotional), dishonesty, and other bad behaviors that can cause one problems in life. Yes, positive peer pressure. It provides a social network of (mostly) good associates for families, including a place for young people to meet other young people who also have higher than average morals and convictions. -- Desirousofchange

  Your statement implies that there is no moral standard or an inferior moral standard among those who are not Witnesses. I was born into and raised in this "faith," but left the organization as a teenager. Similar to your comment above, I was always told by my parents and by witnesses at the kingdom hall that JWs had such higher moral standards than "worldly" people. My experiences proved that the so-called "moral standards" of the witnesses, on average, were no better, and in fact, were inferior to the moral standards of "worldly" people I've known since my departure from the organization. My peers in the congregation had the following results: 2 went to prison for separate, unrelated incidents of cocaine distribution; 1 went to prison for armed robbery, 2 females became pregnant in their teens, and only 1 of the boys I knew became successful in life (and yes, he is still a JW and I do respect him as he is a great man).

  Now, my experiences might be an aberration, but neither the Watchtower nor you have cited any statistics to support the claim that on average JWs have higher moral standards than so-called "worldy" folks have. The Watchtower uses this myth as propaganda to continue its control over the "great crowd."

  Discouraging young people from getting a better education concerns me, but MANY young people in our area are simply ignoring that. Not the majority, but then I don't really know if the majority should go on to college, but the bright ones are. Including elders' children. Nurses. Teachers. IT. Accounting. Even one lawyer. -- DesirousOfChange

  It should do more than concern you, it should cause you to ask the question of why do the JWs discourage higher education? If it's ok for elder's children to go to college, then why do elders preach that higher education is a bad thing? The hypocrisy ought to be a red flag for you! The real reason the Watchtower is against higher education is that they know that those who get an education are likely to question much of the nonsense imposed on the "great crowd" by the Watchtower.

  And, yes, I have come to conclude that it would be a mistake for anyone to plan for one's future like THE END is right around the corner. Too many previous generations did that, and we know what happened. (NOTHING!) As we know, that's come to be the l-o-n-g-e-s-t corner in human history.So, it's best to buy a house, buy life insurance and contribute to the 401K.

  I was there in 1975, and watched as folks sold their homes so they could "pioneer to the end" and made other serious, financial moves based on the lies that were spewed from the platform. It's amazing to me to see the denial, that this was never preached! I can remember being scared as hell that Jehovah would destroy me in October of 1975 because I took a Playboy magazine from a neighbor's trash and hid it at my parent's house.

  The Watchtower's record of false prophecy, including the debacle of 1975, demonstrates a lack of credibility.

  DesirousOfChange,

  You should ask yourself why you desire change, and question all of the so-called "truth" (e.g., the bogus moral standard claims) that has been imposed upon you by the Watchtower. Real truth can withstand scrutiny.
• 

  wasblind

  " Advantage: You can buy cheap polyester suits that even the moths won't eat, and find outlets that sell ties by the pound.

  Disadvantage: You go through life looking like a loser."

  W

  OMG!!!!!

  Laughter soothes the soul, and I'm soothed
• 

  jgnat

  The "JW Advantage" of higher morality doesn't hold up. A revelation for me was a survey conducted by www.barna.org that found that people who profess religious morals have the same divorce rate, for instance, as "worldly" people.

  I worry for teenagers and the inflexibility of the JW agenda. I'm not just talking college education here. I'll tell a true story to illustrate. A hairdresser, knowing her client had spent some time studying the Witnesses, shared her concern about a teenage girl she knew, a Jehovah's Witnesses, and spiralling out of control in drug use. The hairdresser asked if perhaps telling the parents or the elders would help? My friend sadly had to advise "no". Letting the elders know would be the worst thing, as the girl would be cut-off from all supports when she was her most vulnerable.

  As the parent of an adult child with dual-diagnosis (mental illness and drug abuse), I can tell you that a young person in trouble needs all the support they can get - parents being chief among them. Not that I supported his habit, but I persistently and consistently guided him to a clean life. I supported his counsellors and reconfirmed their good advice. That takes tough love, time, attention - lots of time. I'm happy to say my son (in his thirties) is clean today and doing better every day. I get a daily call when he thanks me for all I've done and we reconfirm our love for each other.

  Disfellowshipping and shunning is a harsh discipline. I hope you never have occassion to use it.
• 

  Finally-Free

  OMG!!!!!

  Laughter soothes the soul, and I'm soothed

  I wish I was kidding. I knew an elder who bought ties by the pound, and he gave me a bunch when I was pioneering. As for the suits, I had to go to a funeral 2 weeks ago and found all my good suits had moth holes in them. I ended up wearing one of my cheap suits from my JW days. Lucky I didn't throw them all out.

  W
• 

  wasblind

  " As the parent of an adult child with dual-diagnosis (mental illness and drug abuse), I can tell you that a young person in trouble needs all the support they can get -"

  YES, YES, YES, Jgnat

  FinallyFree, I'm still ROFL
• 

  simon17

  A revelation for me was a survey conducted by www.barna.org that found that people who profess religious morals have the same divorce rate, for instance, as "worldly" people.

  I think the divorce rates, as reported, are virtually the same. But again there is a dichotomy that creates this. The constant stressing of remaining together forces many people to stay together (and I think, for the most part, this is a good thing, especially when children are concerned). But then the dating of JW's puts an overemphasis on marriage, and forces many couple to marry who really shouldn't be together. The problem with witness dating is that things as innocuous as too many texts and phonecalls constitutes dating. It is so easy to be dating, it requires very little. But then, dating immediately implies that marriage is expected. So people are thrust very quickly from showing interest to marriage without the in between steps.

  People need to figure out how to relate to members of the opposite sex. You have to go out with a girl or guy alone to see how to react. You have to date a few people to see what is out there. Only after those things can you be appropriately ready for marriage.

  JW dating advice is so misguided that is forces together so many people who are just not ready or understading of the commitment that marriage means.
• 

  Quendi

  To follow up on the bogus claim of Witness moral superiority, I'll relate my experience in this regard.

  Back in 1994 I met a nice fellow online in a Tolkien newsgroup. We quickly became close friends and the story of our friendship was written up in the local newspaper. What made the story of interest in the community was this fellow is a white South African and I am a black American. We had hoped that we could eventually meet, and we finally did when I traveled to Cape Town to meet him and his entire family in December 1997. What was even more remarkable was the fact that David was of English blood, but his wife was an Afrikaner. Yet I was treated like real family during my entire two-week stay. None of David's family or inlaws were Jehovah's Witnesses. We are very close friends down to this very day.

  What was the reaction of the local brothers where I live in Boulder, Colorado? They were horrified. Didn't I know I was taking a terrible risk by traveling to the ends of the earth to visit and live with "worldly people"? They were even more miffed when they learned that I did not meet with or talk to a single JW during my entire stay. Instead, I met people from all walks of life and different ethnic backgrounds who were warm, kind, hospitable, and generous. It was one of the greatest experiences of my life. But let the Watchtower Society tell it, my experience should never have happened because "worldly people" are completely incapable of this kind of behavior.

  That visit made me think long and hard about the WTS teaching that all "worldly people" will be destroyed without exception on some future Judgment Day. It didn't make sense to me, and it made me start questioning other WTS doctrine. If perfect strangers emerging from the hateful and racist society South Africa had been could treat me with love, affection, and kindness without ever having set foot inside a Kingdom Hall, then that showed you didn't have to be a Witness to act in a way that God approves. Shedding the WTS's chauvinism has been one of the many wonderful benefits I have received since turning my back on this religion.

  Quendi
• 

  simon17

  You'll find good people in all walks of life, and you'll certainly find many friendly faces no matter what sort of "group" you have: religious, band fan clubs, booster clubs, universities, etc.
• 

  Retrovirus

  Desirous of Change wrote:

  Courage is surely an understatement. Someone who has been in for decades feels like they have nothing else to turn to. It's all they know. If you're a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th generation JDub, surely much/most of your family is also "in". All of your friends are other JDubs. You have built a life revolving around JDub tradition. You have taken a stand on things with all your "worldly" peers at school or work or non-witness family. Maybe you have "recruits" in that respect you for "all that you are" in the Truth.....

  Then BAM! Something awakens you.........you start looking at things critically (oh, oh, the WT warns about those who are critical -- it's the first sign)..... you take off the blinders and.........(that's where I am).......

  .............well you know the rest.

  How long does this period of denial last?

  How long before you get over the concern that everything bad happening in your life is divine justice?

  DOC I agree, entirely, courage is too small a word. Yet Martin Luther once said "Here I stand; I can do no other".

  The WT warns about those who are critical - yet the Bible asks for critical thought - "examine all things; hold fast to those which are fine". Great change for good has been brought about by those who refused to have their thinking controlled by governments and religions, but followed their conscience.

  As a non-jw I cannot say how long denial lasts. I stayed in denial about some family stuff for decades before I was forced to deal with it . The delay didn't help one bit.

  There are books and sites that will help with the concern that everything bad happening in your life is divine justice. They are frequently referred to on this site. You'll realise by now that God either loves all of us or none - not a particular religion.

  I wish you all good things, and encouragement, strength and support on your journey. . Happy to talk any time you'd like to.

  Retro