Was the Bible forged? Author claims some New Testament books were written by 'people pretending to be apostles'

by whereami 56 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  Mary

  Terry said: Neither Jesus nor his apostles walked around carrying bookbags like JW's do today. People did not think of books as portable..THEY WEREN'T.

  Pah......sure they did Terry. Didn't you see the picture in one of the latest Craptower study articles showing that they did?! This is actual footage:

  

  For some reason, I don't find this subject very shocking as I've known for years that many of the books of the NT were not written by said book. What is shocking is that I knew this even when I was a Witness as another Witness (an elder actually) told me. At first I was very surprised and I said "you mean Matthew wasn't written by Matthew and John wasn't written by the Apostle John?" He said they most likely were not but he still believed them to be 'inspired'. Very strange...........
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  Terry

  In a separate topic I started yesterday I traced the history of christianity. When the Protestants took on the Catholic heirarchy and tried to bring

  down the Pope's authority as an inerrant arbiter of faith and morals it became necessary to hyper-inflate claims for the bible alone.

  The doctrine of Sola Scripture (invented by Martin Luther) puffed up the Bible as a relic into the BE-ALL and END-ALL inerrant source authority as well as the SOLE foundation necessary for compelte truth.

  The test of inerrancy is easily the most dangerous problem for Protestantism.

  The minute ANY corruption of text is demonstrated----BOOM---there goes your foundation.

  Evangelicals have been insanely defending the bible as inerrant far too long. They are nuts, in fact. Way too many demonstrations of thousands of errors

  have been documented for centuries.

  The Test has been conducted and inerrancy falls.

  Protestant theory is exploded.

  Jehovah's Witnesses rely on a doubly demonstrable error of foundation. Their majestic predictions for Armageddon have repeatedly proved they are FALSE

  PROPHETS. They claim Jehovah directs them toward proper interpretation. So, their demonstrably false predictions brings down their own authority and manages to splash mud on their Jehovah as a clown at the same time.

  The bible has been worshipped and made a fetish by Protestants.

  That is the real problem.

  If none of us had been raised to view the bible as MORE than it really is our ideas about christianity would be more easily rooted in reality.

  Inerrancy claims have produced more Atheists than anything else.
• 

  Terry

  Terry said: Neither Jesus nor his apostles walked around carrying bookbags like JW's do today. People did not think of books as portable..THEY WEREN'T.

  Pah......sure they did Terry. Didn't you see the picture in one of the latest Craptower study articles showing that they did?! This is actual footage

  I stand corrected! Excellent investigative journalism, Mary
• 

  Band on the Run

  My point is that we are cultural supremacists. We value certain things in Western culture, literacy is a big one. It is hard for us to comprehend but an oral tradition can be just as rich and accurate. I've specialist in development of the NT. Ehrmann is way outside the scholarship. I have read a few of his works but don't remember the details. If I were Eastern, I'd remember. Probably, the main thesis of his work is that the Bible did not descend from heaven with God's personal handwriting and magic seal. The assertion that the authors were committing fraud is ludicrous. He knows his assertion is not accurate. Such assertions market books.

  I like sexy gossip, too. The problem is when one believes it.
• 

  dgp

  The assertion that the authors were committing fraud is ludicrous.

  In my humble opinion, no. Protestants of all hues have to agree with me. They claim that the Deuterocanonical books included in Catholic bibles are not real. Jehovah's witnesses think they are not real, either.

  By the way, Catholics come in many hues and have many opinions. You'll find inerrantists as well, but priests, as a group, don't think the Bible is inerrant, in the sense that they do recognize there are many contradictions in the text. And they do accept evolution. I wonder if you can get to read one, but, if you guys happen to have a copy of the "Latin American Bible" in your hands (Spanish only, sorry), read the prologue and you'll find that the Catholic Church does accept evolution as a fact. Meaning they don't really believe in the story of Noah, for example.

  In my opinion, Ehrman has shaken the foundations of all Christian religions, Catholics included, but I thought I should point out this about inerrancy.
• 

  diamondiiz

  What religious affiliation is this guy? hmmmm And old testament isn't forged right? Ok Moses wrote the first five book. ya ok
• 

  Terry

  I've specialist in development of the NT. Ehrmann is way outside the scholarship.

  Can you please give a few examples of Ehrmann being outside of the scholarship and exactly what "outside" means?

  Thanks.
• 

  metatron

  Ah, but less than authentic but more than a forgery.

  If Peter/Paul used a secretary or translator, that's not a forgery. Furthermore, Peter was a speaker, if not a writer, so a secretary makes sense.

  I'll give you that things like 2 Peter were not accepted by all canons but in defense of some of these works, I'd add that they often seem to have no ax to grind or particular doctrine to advocate by their acceptance, so what's the motive?

  Suppose you created a 'forged' Watchtower - that offered the exact same boring drivel as an authentic one? Understand my point?

  metatron
• 

  transhuman68

  Highly qualified assistants are mentioned elsewhere in the New Testament. Thus 1 Peter 5:12: “I write these few words to you through Silvanus, who is a trustworthy brother, to encourage you and attest that this is the true grace of God. Stand firm in it!”

  St Paul's Letter to the Romans 16:22 reads: “I, Tertius, who am writing this letter, greet you in the Lord' ('Ego Tertios ho grapsas ten epistolen'). On the strength of this declaration, the American New Testament scholar Gary Burge entitled a recent article on Tertius 'The Real Writer of Romans'.

  -The Jesus Papyrus (1996)
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  metatron

  Thank you, transhuman, for nailing down the point.

  metatron