do all go to heaven?

master chief

I dont know if you have heard of this one but in revelation it talks about the great crowd standing before the throne rendering sacred service day and night,so what i did is looked in other translations about this and it says great crowd r before the throne in heaven literally and not in a symbolic sense as Jws view it.In the greek interlinear i think it uses the word (naos or hieron)and renders it as being literal but surely wouldnt that be upto the translators discernment.does anyone have anymore info on this ta!!

Fredhall

Chief,

Look in the interlinear at Revelation 14:1-3 and find out how many is going to heaven?

Defender

Fredhall

Do you consider the 12 apostles as part of the 144,000?

If you do, then you have a problem explaining how the 144,000 are virgins and have not defiled themselves with women, when most of the apostles were married. Also, Cornelius, the first Gentile to convert to Christianity was married.

If you do not, then you have a problem with considering the 144,000 as an exact number where the apostles are outside that number and therefore the count should be at least 144,012 not counting Corenlius' household.

D

BERNARD

yeah fred let me see you
answer that question ? lol

Fredhall

Defender,

Are you refering to the interliner?

IslandWoman

If you do, then you have a problem explaining how the 144,000 are virgins and have not defiled themselves with women, when most of the apostles were married. Also, Cornelius, the first Gentile to convert to Christianity was married

Defender,

JWs have an explanation for everything. Like many Christian religions they must twist and manipulate the scriptures and even say that what is said in them is not what is meant; in order to explain their doctrine. It's all a sad, silly mess.

IW

Fredhall

Bernard,

I don't answer questions that can be easy answer from the bible.

Defender

Fredhall

Are you refering to the interliner?

I am refering to the bible. Whatever translation.

barry

Dear Masterchief,
1Thessalonians 4.15 to 18. What we are teaching you now is the Lord's teaching, we who are alive on the day the Lord comes will not go ahead of those who have died. There will be the shout of command, the archangel's voice. the sound of God's trumpet, and the Lord himself will come down from heaven. Those who have died beleiving in Christwill rise to lifefirst; then we who are living at that timewill be gathered up along with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord. So then encourage one another with these words.
From the good news Bible
Barry

AGuest

May you all have peace! May I respond? Thank you!

Indeed, the great crowd all 'go to heaven', in the sense that they, too, enter into the kingdom of God, by means of Christ, and, as kings and priests, 'render sacred service in the temple'. Only priests CAN 'render SACRED service' in the temple, dear Fred.

Revelation 5:9, 10

This was the 'sacred secret' that Paul spoke about, which secret was the cause for him being named an apostle... TO THE NATIONS! The 12 were apostles to Israel, and thus, became witnesses of my Lord "in all Judea and Samaria". Judea was the land of the Jews (the 2-tribe kingdom of Judah, made up of Judah and Benjamin), with its capital city of Jerusalem - and the temple. Samaria was the land of the 10-tribe kingdom of Israel, with its capital city of Bethel.

Israel was initially chosen by God to be a 'special' nation. Why? Because the Israelites were a good and clean people? On the contrary, they proved themselves over and over again to be a hard-hearted, hard-headed, stiff-necked, rebellious and UNFAITHFUL people. They were chosen... due to Abraham... and for that reason ONLY. Abraham proved himself to be God's "friend" by not withholding HIS only-begotten son, Isaac, but being willing to sacrifice him to God.

My Father, the Holy One of Israel, JAH OF ARMIES, stopped this sacrifice, of course - He didn't NEED Isaac; He only wanted to see where Abraham's heart was. Abraham PROVED his love, by his willingness to obey, even if it meant losing his beloved son. This corresponded to what God was going to do for ABRAHAM... and HIS 'seed'... Israel. God... made Abraham a PROMISE. But, Abraham's progeny proved itself unworthy of such a privilege... to BE a 'chosen race'... over and over again. Did God reject them immediately? No, He did not. It was not until they put to death in the flesh the very One He sent to SAVE ISRAEL... that Israel was rejected as that 'chosen' race. But not utterly.

In place of unfaithful Israel, God opened the way for THE NATIONS to become part of that 'chosen' race. All such ones needed to do was put faith in the One by means of whom they could come into a covenant relationship WITH God - the Israelites entered into a covenant by means of Moses; now... the 'way' into a covenant with God was by means of HIS Son, my Lord, JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH.

And those of the nations who put faith in such One... and DEMONSTRATED that faith by (1) KNOWING, in FAITH, that he was indeed alive, resurrected from the dead as a SPIRIT, and thus 'with' US and able to SPEAK to us; (2) OBEYING such One WHEN he spoke; (3) and loving ALL those he commanded us to love, INCLUDING our 'enemies'... have in essence REPLACED... Israel. But not ALL of Israel.

In keeping true to His promise to Abraham, my Father, the Holy One of Israel, JAH OF ARMIES, designated, by means of Christ, 144,000 slots... to be occupied by "the sons of Israel, 12,000 from each tribe"! Together, these... the 144,000 taken "from among the sons of Israel"... AND... the "great crowd which NO man was able to number"... become a 'nation of kings and priests'... and 'render sacred service in the temple... day and night.'

THAT IS THE WHOLE PURPOSE FOR PAUL BECOMING AN APOSTLE TO THE NATIONS, to call, FROM AMONG THE NATIONS... people of FAITH... to rule WITH Christ... and Israel.

What, though, does that mean for the REST of Israel? Will they be destroyed? Nope. God does not lie. Instead, rather than the entire nation of Israel being a 'chosen' nation, only 144,000 of that nation are counted in... and the REST... are ruled OVER... by the nations. The result to Israel? Everlasting SHAME... for having 'lost' their privileged place before God... to the nations. To those of the nations who had FAITH... and 'exercised' it... even though 'not Israel'. For as my Father said, "those NOT Israel, I shall call Israel."

ALL of these, the 144,000 AND the great crowd... 'go to heaven'... or rather 'enter'... into the kingdom of God. And along with THESE... are the "sheep", those who 'did good to [Christ's] brothers. Such ones are granted entry into the kingdom as well... as SUBJECTS of that kingdom when that kingdom returns to the earth... as it once was when Eden was 'visible'... when New Jerusalem "COMES DOWN OUT OF HEAVEN"... to the earth... to be "UPON THE EARTH". It is by means of this kingdom... New Jerusalem... then, that "the meek INHERIT THE EARTH"... and "RESIDE FOREVER UPON IT"... in that they 'dwell' in the City of God, New Jerusalem, which will be ON THE EARTH, as it once was.

And while, yes, New Jerusalem IS 'upon the earth'... it is NOT occupied by flesh with its blood, just as Eden was NOT occupied by flesh with its blood, for flesh with its blood CANNOT enter into the City. Such ones, flesh with its blood, exist OUTSIDE the city... among Gog... and Magog... those who, once Satan has been loosed, 'come against the holy city.'

It is then that Gog... the 'goats' previously 'cut off' from entry... and Magog... and the wicked spirits banned from entry... are destroyed by fire... which comes OUT of heaven... from the person of my Father, JAH OF ARMIES. And it is THIS way, then, that both the heavens (spirit realm) AND the earth (physical realm)... that 'are stored up for fire'... are cleansed. The result? A NEW heavens and a NEW earth... one withOUT wicked beings, either physical OR spiritual.

I hope this helps to shed a bit of 'light' on the matter, which light I have received from the True Light, the Son of God and His Christ, my Lord, JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH.

Matthew 5:14-16

Again, peace to you!

A slave of Christ,

SJ

do all go to heaven?

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