by jgnat 85 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
godrulz, can you do anything other than write declarative statements?
"true" and "false" still grates me. If Satan is "false" is he perhaps a construct (i.e. unreal)? If real, what sort of "powers" does he have, and if any, doesn't that make him a god?
God alone is true God by nature. He alone is worthy of worship. He alone is eternal, omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent. The main definition of God/Deity relates to the one, true, living God.
Are you a relativist? Do you have a problem with 2+2=4 being true and 2+2=5 being false (true/false is descriptive, not dirty words).
Any other gods are so-called, false gods, not God/Deity by inherent uncreated nature. I can make anything a god, but it will not be the eternal, uncreated, worthy, Living God. Satan is called a god, but he is clearly a false god. He is not eternal, not good, not holy, not loving. He does not have the attributes or character of Deity. He wants people to worship him as a god, but that does not make Him eternal God worthy of worship.
Satan is real, personal. He is supernatural spirit, but finite. His power and authority is limited. His final destiny will be the lake of fire.
I can tell you the biblical view, but you can accept or reject it as true. If you have a low view of Scripture (vs infallible, inspired, authoritative), then we do not have the same source for truth. Your sources would be fallible and should bow to Scripture. If you do not think the Bible is God's Word, then your opinions are as good or bad as any other person.
God is a responsible Creator and has revealed Himself in creation, Christ, Word of God. The Bible claims to be inspired. Jesus also views the OT as such.
I am not sure why you have an aversion to absolutes. It is possible to be right or wrong on any given issue. Why assume we all must be wrong or non-dogmatic about everything.
JGNat, in your list of mortal gods you forgot the Greatest One, the Heavenly Father, Comrade Kim Il Sung? He passed away but continues to be North Korea's "Eternal President". And please do not forget the Dear Leader, our Father, Generalissimo Kim Jong Il.
My impression is that we have no proof of the existence of one god or many. Or, conversely, that monotheists and polytheists believe they are right and they also believe they have "proofs" of their assertions.
Thank you for rounding out my list, dgp. I am more familiar with the African mortal gods.
godrulz, the bible can be proven to be faulty. I prefer to believe that God is not. Therefore the premise that God has protected the bible from all error is wrong. The alternative is to twist God in to a creature that few would willingly follow. (i.e. hate is love).
godrulz: God alone is true God by nature. He alone is worthy of worship. He alone is eternal, omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent. The main definition of God/Deity relates to the one, true, living God.
The only reason to think that God requires worship is because the Bible says so, but in reality, the True God neither requires nor desires worship. We need to first understand how Love works before we can define what is true and what is not. Love is unconditional sharing, compassion, and gratitude, among other things. This whole idea of "I'm the best", "I'm the only one", "I'm jealous" is telling us that Biblegod has an ego, a very big and dangerous one. The Supreme God has no such insecurities. The simple fact that Jehovah is constantly warning about the worship of other gods is clear evidence that they do exist in his own mind. Only an Ego God could order murder and mayhem. If there was some "Supreme Purpose" for the atrocities in the Bible beyond our understanding, then those atrocities accomplished nothing as the "chosen nation" experiment was a complete failure. If it was supposed to teach us something about the final solution, Jesus dying on a cross, well, take a look around. Things are worse than ever over the last 2,000 years. Therefore, Biblegod is an impotent mole. When we wake up to that fact, we are empowered in Truth. This is the suppressed teaching of Jesus and ALL the Masters, the Bible, and the underlying truth of every religion.
The literal reading is meant to keep the uninitiated in servitude of the initiated.
You're welcome, JGNat.
godrulz, consider these words:
"The other thing I cannot help remarking upon is the overweening confidence with which the religious assert minute details for which they neither have, nor could have, any evidence. Perhaps it is the very fact that there is no evidence to support theological opinions, either way, that fosters the characteristic draconian hostility towards those of slightly different opinion, especially, as it happens, in this very field of Trinitarianism.
Jefferson heaped ridicule on the doctrine that, as he put it, 'There are three Gods', in his critique of Calvinism. But it is especially the Roman Catholic branch of Christianity that pushes its recurrent flirtation with polytheism towards runaway inflation. The Trinity is (are?) joined by Mary, 'Queen of Heaven', a goddess in all but name, who surely runs God himself a close second as a target of prayers. The pantheon is further swollen by an army of saints, whose intercessory power makes them, if not demigods, well worth approaching on their own specialist subjects. The Catholic Community Forum helpfully lists 5,120 saints, together with their areas of expertise, which include abdominal pains, abuse victims, anorexia, arms dealers, blacksmiths, broken bones, bomb technicians and bowel disorders, to venture no further than the Bs. And we mustn't forget the four Choirs of Angelic Hosts, arrayed in nine orders: Seraphim, Cherubim, Thrones, Dominions, Virtues, Powers, Principalities, Archangels (heads of all hosts), and just plain old Angels, including our closest friends, the ever-watchful Guardian Angels. What impresses me about Catholic mythology is partly its tasteless kitsch but mostly the airy nonchalance with which these people make up the details as they go along. It is just shamelessly invented." (Richard Dawkins).
Christianity in all its forms masquerades as monotheistic religion. There's only one uberGod, but a lot of lesser gods, too. Conspicuous by its absense is the god of common sense.
God is the most valuable, awesome, beautiful, glorious, majestic being (perfect) in the universe. Value obligates. He is worthy of worship. This is not selfish nor ego. If there was something more valuable, we would be obligated to exalt it. The Bible portrays God being worshipped. He commands worship, in spirit and in truth. Revelation/heaven is a scene of endless worthship/worship. He is exalted. Isaiah has God saying there are no other gods before or after Him. He knows none. False gods are so-called gods, not true God by nature.
You guys are in a vacuum of spiritual ignorance due to rejection of Christ and His Word.
P.S. Only the original autographs are inspired, but translations are highly accurate due to the wealth of manuscript evidence.
Godrulz wrote
God alone is true God by nature. He alone is worthy of worship. He alone is eternal, omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent. The main definition of God/Deity relates to the one, true, living God.
This is a basic premise for me too.
However, ProdigalSon wrote
The simple fact that Jehovah is constantly warning about the worship of other gods is clear evidence that they do exist in his own mind.
and I am not at all sure that this is so. If God is eternal, omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent, those qualities do not necessarily mean that he requires worship. Nor do they preclude it. Even Godrulz said that he is worthy or worship, not that he requires it.
I do agree with this though
This whole idea of "I'm the best", "I'm the only one", "I'm jealous" is telling us that Biblegod has an ego, a very big and dangerous one.
And that's the crunch. The Old Testament tells us that the God portrayed there is a jealous God, and during my time within the WT setup I noticed they do put great emphasis on the OT, and constantly re-iterate concepts like "Jehovah's feelings". The Bible is seen as inspired.
I'm not arguing whether or not the whole Bible is inspired. I suspect it is, but, and here's the important bit, it is filtered through human beings. Just ordinary human beings. Well, even allowing for a bit more tyhan ordinary in some cases, still human beings.
The couple who conducted my study kept on about the word by word inspiration of the Bible. The sister would even say things like "when God wrote the Bible", and when I said, "No people wrote the Bible" I was told I wasn't even a Christian. That kind of primitive thinking gets nowhere.
My point is that it is the OT and Revelations that give us the idea that God of himself requires worship. Although he may do, I think it's conceivable that he does not, of himself require any such thing, because he is, as ProdigalSon rightly says, Love. Jesus shows us what Love is. We don't see Jesus referring to his Heavenly Father as jealous.
Godrulz - God is a lie - a control mechanism for the gullible!
