Why do the women put up with it?

by JeffT 10 Replies latest jw friends

  • JeffT
    JeffT

    My question was sparked by a comment on another board, regarding Islamic women.

    "Exactly; look up the details of the "honor killing" epidemic and the extent to which women are the primary movers and motivators behind the murders is startling. Also, looking at the secular countries that are being threatened by Islamic fundamentalism (Malaysia, Indonesia, Egypt, Turkey) and woman are at the forefront in returning to wearing the niquab/burka and accepting Islamic oppression. Exactly why is a good question; it defies common sense that half the population should want to be enslaved but that appears to be the case."

    My first thought was the women of JWN might be able to shed some insight on this. Let's face it, the WTBS doesn't think much of its women, or treat them very well. Why, particularly in the US and European countries do the women tolerate their treatment at the KH? They have to know that they don't deserve to be treated like cattle. There are days looking at things like talks about dress, that I think JW men would put their women in burkas if they could. Why don't the women just get up and walk out?

    I'm curious what you think.

  • Broken Promises
    Broken Promises

    Why don't the women just get up and walk out?

    I did.

  • Paralipomenon
    Paralipomenon

    If I'm not mistaken women also make up the "large army" of the WTS. I think it's less about wanting to be oppressed and more about being passionate about their religious belief.

  • watson
    watson

    The faces of radical Islam are men's, but the power rests with the women...

  • blondie
    blondie

    Abuse of women is not unique to the WTS, it is a carryover from the community at large. The WTS just continues it and gives it a "scriptural" foundation. My husband was an elder and did not tolerate it and bucked the BOE several times when abuse of wives came up and brought them into the 21st century and showed where it was wrong by TRUE standards that were to reflect love.

    As to women, as in the case of any situation of abuse, leaving is not so easy if you do not have support from people and money. As a man your understanding of what women face seems to be limited.

    http://www.helpguide.org/mental/domestic_violence_abuse_help_treatment_prevention.htm

  • NomadSoul
    NomadSoul

    All I know is my mom whipped things around after she became inactive. My father used to run the show and would have the WTBS as back up. He would make bad financial decisions and disciplined with an iron fist. Now that my mom is the major income provider and is more liberal, she's the head of the household. She now takes his paycheck and takes care of everything else, and of course now without the WTBS protection he just obliges. Of course it helps that I the grown males in the family back her as up as well.

    It's funny seeing a different household that I grew up in. I wish that would've happened when I was growing up.

  • Dune
    Dune

    It's easy to put up with almost anything if you're indoctrinated from birth. I was watching a show about gypsys the other day, and was surprised to learned that girls were taught early on that their main purpose was to get married and start a family leading to an average age of marriage of 16/17 for girls.

    "Informed" individuals look at this sort of thing with disgust, but imagine being born into such a situation and never having a frame of reference to compare your own life to, this would just seem normal and you'd go about your day.

  • MrFreeze
    MrFreeze

    Its the idea of they are told to be submissive. Good little dubs wont get out of line. I see it in their faces, the women hate it, but what can they do besides leave the borg?

  • No Room For George
    No Room For George

    Hmmm..good questions, although speaking from my own experiences in congregations, women don't have it nearly as bad as the men. Not to mention many conservative women are A-OK with their place within the average Kingdom Hall, just like the women in fundamentalist Islamic lands are pushing for a more conservative if not extremist version of Islamic influence throughout the region. I guess its similar to MADD, or Prohibition which if memory serves me correct, both were spearheaded by ultra conservative women reminiscent of Church Lady on SNL.

    Speaking from the perspective of a born-in male who was expected to get baptized, expected to run microphones, expected to reach out to become a Ministerial Servant, expected to handle literature, expected to handle territories, expected to give talks away and at home, expected to support the group overseer at the book study as it then existed and expected to oversee the group in his absense, expected to eventually become an Elder, I feel that men are treated more like cattle than the women are. Young men are bred like cattle, and then slaughtered and packaged for consumption by the organization. The WT STudy from yesterday is a perfect example as one of the paragraphs talked about it being acceptable for a brother who's been baptized for a year, to possibly qualify as a Ministerial Servant.

    I don't want to take away from the seriousness of what women have to put up with in this organization, but their expectations are less than men in my opinion.

  • Band on the Run
    Band on the Run

    My mom had no self-esteem or family/friend support. The few times she told others about how my father beat us all to a pulp, the Witness ones remarked tough luck. Killing someone is not adultery. I screamed at her about it. She infuriated me with her blind acceptance. I all too readily see the low standards I accept knowing I am worth more. I was very judgmental. In fact, she is what is termed as a covert abuser. The active abuser cannot abuse without the support of the covert abuser.

    She took him to court before I was born. The judge remakred how dangerous he was b/c he did not flinch before the judge. His penis gave me a right from Jehovah. The shame was enormous. YOu feel you did something wrong. She worked in contravention of what the brothers said. Altho she earned far more than he did, she turned over her entire paychecks. We did not have food at one point.

    She was expelled from school at fourteen b/c of flag salute. Where was she going to find a role model for herself? I was the catalyst. Many times I felt that I was her mother. I wrote to a mag and got help. She cooperated. Her big thing was reacting rather than acting which is the norm for abuse victims. I was hyper critical. Even sexual abuse being warned about did not stop her support. She despised him more than we did.

    He died when I was sixteen. It was the first time in my entire life I could breathe. She never looked people in the eye and rarely conversed. One year later, she was a different person, outgoing and gregarious. With a daughter who wanted reparations. No one support me or loved me more than she did. As I grew, I did nutsy, irrational things. The agency forced her to apologize. Before she died, she apoligized sincerely and it was no victory for me. Her actions for the rest of my life showed her guilt over what happened. She did the best she could under circumstances I never had to face. I stopped throwing stones.

    I became and remain an ardent feminist. As Margaret Mead told us and we did not want to hear it, women are hobbled by their biology. Men don't bear and nurture children. Altho women can do the vast majority of jobs men can, there remains a segment where female strength is nothing compared to male strength. Indeed, the NYC fire dept was ordered to admit any women who passed an objective test. It was more than a decade before a woman could be found to pass the test. We tend to stay and advocate for children more than men.

    Even today, societal messages give women a second class status. Watch old I Love Lucy reruns to see how sick the culture was. Within my lifetime only, the Ivy League became coed. Women were not allowed to serve on juries or hold property separately if married. Any child over four or five, the father automatically received custody. A pink ghetto remains where comparable jobs are paid last.

    I believe empowering women would be the end of the Watchtower. Their self hatred is evident. Having a penis may be nice but it does not confer power or competence. They demote themselves to bite into this paternal system. The govt's main task to stop the Taliban's in fluence was to educate women. Many parts of the world it is illegal for women to learn to read.

    It annoys me greatly when American women put down feminism. I say- leave all the benefits it gave you. Of course, when inside the org, how is any woman going to see that her ideas and actions are as valid as those of any man. It is very sad. The surfeit of brothers is another problem. Men are not attracted to this crazy reason. Woman can be masochistic. Other women are keen competition to marry the very few brothers present.

    Ordinary joes who are nice and kind will not want nothing of this cult. It has to attract insecure men. These men have none of the trappings that attract women in general. I find the men emasculated in many ways. To compensate, they put women down. IMO.

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit