I'd like to mention that moral arguments for or against God are off topic.
"Who created the intelligent creator?"
by mankkeli 49 Replies latest jw friends
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darthfader
Silly Question... It's Creators all the way down..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turtles_all_the_way_down
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In my not so humble opinion, given the infinite existence of the multiverse, we have existed before and will exist again. It doesn't matter if this universe ends with heat death (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_death_of_the_universe) or the big crunch.
Given an infinite amount of time, everything is possible. Including our existence...
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sinis
Journey on - I like your reasoning. Why would God, if perfect, and intelligent create billions/trillions of stars and galaxies within our know universe? Why? Especially if most are not inhabited? Once again why? Its like building a few widgets, and continuing to build them just for your own pleasure, when in reality every widget is basically the same or in groups. Once again why? Now we start getting into the grit - if the universe came about by accident, where did that energy come from, and so on and so on? How far do we go back before we have an acceptable answer? Where did the matter/energy come, and up the ladder we go... we will never know. Maybe, this is all a hologram, like the matrix, stranger shit is possible...
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darthfader
sinis -- your thought of the universe being a hologram is the basis of this theory:
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botchtowersociety
Who ever thought of that has done way too much LSD.
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sinis
OK, so WHERE did the energy come from? EVERYTHING, I MEAN EVERYTHING has a beginning and an end. Stars, planets, galaxies are being born and dieing. If I have 55 gallons of water and I will always have 55 gallons of water (matter/energy), no matter if it turns to ice or steam, the question begs WHERE did the 55 gallons of water come from, if NOTHING existed. Even NOTHING is something - the container shell exists, where did it come from. What houses the shell? Why in theory and testing does time slow down outside of earth? Is "time" the definative element? Then again WHERE did time originate?
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darthfader
Everything we are in this universe came out of the slight inbalance between matter and antimatter.. Fortunately for us in this universe, matter won out, but only by a small fraction. As the universe cooled down, we now have elements and compounds like 55 gallon drums and water.
http://livefromcern.web.cern.ch/livefromcern/antimatter/academy/AM-travel02c.html
Time slows down because when you are in space, you are further away from Earth's gravity well. Also, the faster you travel also has a slowing effect on time. By combining those two effects, sateliites have software to compensate for differences in timing clocks.
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botchtowersociety
OK, so WHERE did the energy come from?
I have an answer that satisfies me. Although I am open to more evidence and encourage investigation.
Why in theory and testing does time slow down outside of earth?
Time slows down because when you are in space, you are further away from Earth's gravity well.
"Outside the earth" is a big area.
In orbit, time flows faster than it does from our vantage point here--not slower.
Satellite clocks run faster than clocks on the Earth's surface. We are at the bottom of a sizable gravity well and it slows down time.
Now, if you find yourself deeper in some other gravity well off planet, such as at the bottom of Jupiter's atmosphere, then yes, time would flow slower there than from our point of reference on Earth, all other factors (such as velocity) being equal.
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sinis
Which begs the question were did the original energy come from (factors of cooling and heating are indications of energy)? You cannot put nothing into something and get something back. CERN is putting something (massive energy) into a collider to get "something" back out. Without ENERGY or "something", nothing is on the other side of the equation. 0 + 0 = 0
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sinis
Botch - thats why I reference "time" its an element based on MATTER/ENERGY. So once again, where did matter/energy come from if NOTHING existed prior to the event? Its like rewinding the universal magnetic tape on the universal VCR on EVERTHING back to the beginning. I mean EVERYTHING - the child just born, atomic decay taking place while being born, nutrients, sex, etc. down to the parents, their life, the tree outside dropping a leaf, the nutrient factor of the tree, the seed, the soil, the sunlight, while trillions of other functions are happening at the same time ALL the way back to the very beginning of time. If energy existed where did that energy come from? If it did not, once again where did something come from nothing?