If this is indeed CO Elwood Johnson and NOT Sam Herd, Randy at freeminds would almost certainly want to know about it.
Witness plays Gov. Body Samuel Herd talk for me.....is he mentally ill??
by Witness 007 45 Replies latest watchtower scandals
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ziddina
Bumpin' the thread again...
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punkofnice
Ziddina you marvelous dragon with a tail...I started then stopped for a breather. Just a cursory glance at part of this crackpot talk =
The smart and determined runner trains hard for the finish line. Every nerve, every muscle, every sinew must be strained. (Is he on steroids?) His lungs must bellow if he wants to win. And he knows that the worst thing that can happen to him is to start out with a burst of speed only to have his legs give out and his lungs fail as he reaches his goal. So what does he do? Long before the event, he trains. He trains hard to acquire strength, endurance, proper technique to learn obedience to the rules, because only in this way can he make his dash to the finish a winning success. (Why do I sense this is a set up?)
Now an alert runner takes note as he runs his course because all along the way there are markers that tell him where he is in the race. This tells him how he must harness his energies, it tells him whether he is near the finish and whether his kick needs to be stronger and higher; whether or not he needs to put all his speed into it or whether he needs to measure his gauge, his stride. (But…but…I thought JWs weren’t supposed to be athletes..or even want to be like them. Yet this illustration is about a ‘smart’ runner. I’m confused. Not really, it’s going to be a propagandist’s paradise!)
Now so it is with the Christian . (BANG! And we’re in…let the propaganda begin! We all know the term ‘Christian’ = JW)
As we move to the conclusion of this system of things, (That’s presupposing it really exists) as we come to the finish line, there are makers all along the way that tell us where we are and what we should be doing. (Does he mean ‘obey the GB’ by any chance?) I want you to open your Bibles to the book of Matthew chapter 24, and this is where the heart of our discussion is going to be tonight. It is going to be based primarily on Matthew 24, although we will be using other scriptural text.
Our interest lies particularly in Jesus statements found in the 24th chapter of Matthew. Here in the 24th chapter of Matthew, Jesus said something that certainly ought to catch our attention, (Appeal to authority) because it is a marker. It tells us where we are and what we should be doing. Beginning with verse 21 of Matthew chapter 24, Jesus says this, “For then there will be great tribulation such as has not occurred since the worlds beginning until now, no, nor will occur again. In fact, unless those days were cut short, no flesh would be saved. But on account of the chosen ones, those days will be cut short.” And then Jesus goes on to add other mile post, he says first as you make your dash to the finish, you’re going to see a thing called the great tribulation. He said this thing is going to be horrendous. (Appeal to fear) And unless it’s cut short, absolutely no one would be able to survive it, because it’s going to be just that bad.
Immediately he says in verse 29, let your eye go to verse 29, “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.” See that’s another marker. And quickly you come upon another marker (verse 30), “And then the sign of the Son of man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in lamentation, and they will see the Son of man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. (verse 31) And he will send forth his angels with a great trumpet sound, and they will gather his chosen ones together from the four winds, from one extremity of the heavens to their other extremity.”
Now what Jesus is outlining for us here is the dash to the finish itself. (Sorry Mate, you missed out VS; 23-28 which accurately describes the WBT$) These markers are going to come clipping along as we move to the conclusion of this system of things. And the reason why we’re raising this question is because once you get into that first marker, it will be a steady and a very rapid downhill slide to the goal from then on. (I think he’s making this up!) It will not be a time for you to adjust your stride, or to rethink your position. It will be a fast moving time. It will happen like this: And then, and then, and then, and then, … and then it will be over. (On what basis does he make these assumptions?) What you have not done you will not be able to do. (Appeal to fear) Where you have not adjusted, you will not be able to adjust. (Appeal to fear) You will not find some new supposed strength at that particular time. (Appeal to fear) You are going to run the way you have been trained to run . (What like protecting paedos in the congregations, gambling in hedge funds, NGO status with Satan’s UN?)
It is just as if a runner, who has trained for years for a race, he’s not going to all of a sudden, on the day of the race, change his style. (Appeal to fear) It’s too late for that. (Appeal to fear) And chances are if he tried to change during the course of the race, he’d lose anyway, (hasty overgeneralization) because it would cause too much confusion. (Appeal to fear)
Let’s take a look at the first marker. Go back to the 24th chapter and look at verse 21. “For then there will be great tribulation.” The first marker opens up with the destruction of Babylon the Great. (Really? Where in Matthew did Jesus say that then?) That is when everything kicks off. (Sensationalism) Immediately with this destruction of Babylon the Great, you are and I are in for the race of a lifetime. (Appeal to fear)
Open your Bibles to Revelation now and you’ll get an idea as to some of the things that will occur once the tribulation begins. It will start with the fall of Babylon the Great. Turn to Revelation chapter 17 and here you will see a very exciting thing occur. Beginning with verse 2, start in part of verse 1, it says, ““Come. I will show you the judgment upon the great harlot who sits on many waters, (verse 2) with whom the kings of the earth committed fornication, whereas those who inhabit the earth were made drunk with the wine of her fornication.”” (This scripture has little or no connection with Matthew’s gospel. Neither does it identify Bab the Great as non JW religions) Now what will this judgment be? How will things turn out? What will it look like? Well, cast your eye down to verse 10, “And there are seven kings: five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet arrived, but when he does arrive he must remain a short while. (verse 11) And the wild beast that was but is not, it is also itself an eighth [king], but springs from the seven, and it goes off into destruction.” And then in verse 13, “These have one thought, and so they give their power and authority to the wild beast.” And what do they do with this newfound power, this singular thought? Verse 16, “And the ten horns that you saw, and the wild beast, these will hate the harlot and will make her devastated and naked, and will eat up her fleshy parts and will completely burn her with fire. (verse 17) For God put [it] into their hearts to carry out his thought, even to carry out [their] one thought by giving their kingdom to the wild beast.” (Blah blah blah, yadda yadda yadda. Mystical manipulation. Foolish typology.)
In other words, Jehovah God is going to cause some sort of madness, some kind of crazed madness (this is getting very ‘weasel wordy’ and adding to the scripture things that aren’t there) to come over the world powers in the near future, and they will attack Babylon, and they will rip and tear her for all she’s worth. If you paid real close attention, (No doubt the speaker is clever enough to pay ‘real close attention’ but we lowly drone are not) the stage is already being set for that. Already they have no compunction whatsoever about putting the religious clergy in jail now. (Where does this speculation come from? Oh, yes. WBT$ propaganda) They have no sanctity or feeling toward the religious clergy, they’re cutting and slashing them in the face in New York. (This really is getting weird!) They’re breaking into convents and robbing the nuns, raping the nuns if you will. (If I will? No, I won’t. This is a very weird talk at this stage ) They’re even breaking into churches and robbing them, they’re robbing preachers on the streets. (Not mugging JWs? Not breaking into Kingdum Hells?) So the appetite to attack Babylon is already there. (Is it? Where? Mystical manipulation) Jehovah is going to simply open their mouths wide and they will chew her all to pieces and burn what’s left. (Appeal to fear) It will be a most frightening time brothers, (Appeal to fear) when that marker shows up. Even the world (Us vs: them loaded language) will be terrified at what they see actually happening to the churches. (Appeal to fear)
I’m stopping right here. It’s like a speech from the Nuremburg rally. This guy is raving like a nut job!
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Mary
I gotta bookmark this one for later......
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punkofnice
Look at what it says here at verse 9 of chapter 18 of Revelation, ““And the kings of the earth who committed fornication with her and lived in shameless luxury will weep and beat themselves in grief over her,” [crying, whining sounds] “ (Making literal application of a vague ‘vision’ as an ‘appeal to authority’ with the crying as an ‘appeal to fear’) when they look at the smoke from the burning of her, (verse 10) while they stand at a distance because of their fear of her torment and say, ‘Too bad, too bad, you great city, Babylon you strong city, because’” we don’t have any more Christmas, no more Easter, and we can’t have any more political elections in your churches. (Fiction! Fallacy of presumption. Appeal to fear. Fallacy of compostion. Irrelevant conclusion.)
And Babylon will be destroyed. It will not be a matter to be funny with us, (Uh?) because once you see it happen, the religious clergy will be cut down and the political leaders will obviously know that they are next. They stand back because they see that this must be the hand of God. (Appeal to authority. Appeal to fear) They will know that something is terribly different here when they see the religious parties and other things being destroyed. (Appeal to loyalty/popularity. Verbose argument)
Now, this is very important, because once that time hits, what will you and I need? (Nothing. It’s not happening!) What will we need then when we see this system coming to the conclusion – will it be a new car? (No. I prefer a Winnebago) Will you need a new house ? (Just a Winnebago will do it) Will you need a new pair of shoes? (No because I don’t waste time walking the streets knocking at empty houses pedalling dangerous propaganda) A new coat? (Look Ellwood, I told you it’s not happening. Quit it already!) A new bottle of perfume? (Oh, for the love-a-Pete!) Will you need the latest toiletries or a fancy hairdo? (No! I’m smelly and bald. OK?!?!) Will you need a new dress? (No! I’m a bloke ----- Notice the ‘fallacy of many questions’)
Once you see that happening, it will not be your money. (Money? No one’s got any!! Lend us a quid. I’m broke anyway) Your most valuable possession at that time will be your faith in God. (Appeal to imaginary friends) Because once it hits, it is going to be so furious, no one will survive it except by the grace (‘Grace’? Did he just say that?) and protection of God himself. (Appeal to authority, appeal to fear) And the question is – will you be ready for that? Will you have the courage to go out and speak whatever message God will dictate for that particular time and situation. (Sure. No one’s listening. They’re all to busy raping nuns or going to New York to flog the Bishop!)
If we tremble now, and we find it difficult to have a share in the preaching of the good news (WBT$ propaganda to get cash and power for the GB) under these circumstances, if this is our training at this point, please don’t imagine that you’re going to find some newfound courage to get up and to speak when they are bursting Babylon all to pieces and anyone who dares to come up and says anything religious whatsoever. (So whatever happened to Mark 13:11? ‘’ Whenever you are arrested and brought to trial, do not worry beforehand about what to say. Just say whatever is given you at the time, for it is not you speaking, but the Holy Spirit.’’ This is clearly an advert, outright propaganda, to go door knocking and recruit victims to the JW cancer) Don’t imagine that you’re going to find some newfound courage to tell the truth or to speak the truth if you can’t do it now. (IE. Do MORE now!)
And then, immediately after Babylon is destroyed, almost as without a break, look at verse 29 of Matthew 24, “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.” (I tells ya. He’s making it ALL up!)
Now in what sense will be the sun be darkened? The moon not give its light? The stars fall from heaven? The powers of the heavens be shaken? Doubtless, doubtless, (Double weasel!) in the early part of this great tribulation, the many luminaries, prominent clergymen (Non sequitur) of the world, the political ‘lights’, the economical ‘lights’, those who are supposed to know their way out of things; (Ad hominem) the religious clergy who are supposed to be able to cut a deal with God so that you’ll be saved; the economic prognosticators who tell you how you can make money so that you can be rich. (Ad hominem, appeal to fear, same team fallacy)
(Strewth this is so hard going I quit for now! The whole thing is just fiction, statements without proof. Ridiculous ‘typology’. All the logical fallacies you can think of)
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AvocadoJake
I grew up with a fear of death, I have those to thank who asked "You are being a good little boy Jake? You don't want to be fodder for the birds do you?" I finally got over my fear when, I started to party with some crazy men and women in the late 1980s. Do you remember the book "Paradise Lost and Paradise regained?" and those wonderful portraits of kids being offered up to the false god Molech? Nice book to show your four year old, nice bed-time story book, makes you feel scared and you end up in Mom and Dad's bed, a nervous wreck. I am careful with my 6 and 10 year old, and what they read and listen to. When some whacko says something like you posted above, my kids have learned to accept, they have either dementia, or might be on some medication that is causing some social ineptness!
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AvocadoJake
"Life is Short" how do you deal with having a pedophile in your midst? Was it proved, he was a indecent fellow or is it just part of the rumor mill?
Did you BOE warn you about the tendencies and likes of the him? Is the BOE keeping his indentity a big secret to protect him? I find it odd that, a pedophile which according to most psychological studies, has close to a zero chance of changing their ways. There are so big studies done, that prove we need to have child sex offenders on a list for public notice. Yet there are situations that are wrong and overkill. For example "A boy who turned 18 has sex with a girl who is 17 years old. He gets convicted and put on the national sex offender list, he marries the girl he had sex with. They have been married for 15 years with three kids, and he is still on the list." This is a real case in Texas that is trying to be overturned, and hopefully will be for the sake of justice. -
punkofnice
Jake - My Dad used the old 'paradise' book to 'teach' me the 'truth'. I noticed even an animal falling down the hole in the earth in the armageddon illustration.
They run their antichrist power and money hungry pyramid business with a that poses as a religion with a brand name god using guilt, fear and phobia. This is all to control the 'mind cleansed' 'rand & file'.
Perhaps the political gurus who tell you how they’re going to work out this world’s problems and situations. (This doesn’t make sense) When that time hits, the Bible will thoroughly expose them as being no nothings and nobodies and they will not be able to save anyone. (How will the Bible expose them at this fictitious point in time? Appeal to authority. Appeal to fear) It will be as if all the stars in the heavens went out. And all the powers of the very heavens will be shaken. (Non sequitur)
Can you imagine the confusion of people who put all their stock and faith in the religious clergy and only to see them destroyed at the opening (?) of the great tribulation? (No! It’s fiction) Can you imagine people walking around the streets with clubs looking for whoever might be left of the religious clergy? (No! It’s fiction) Looking for them yes! “We want to find you because, you know, we had a chance to get a Bible study, a 19 free weeks course, and you told us that those Jehovah’s witnesses are not to be fooled with. (HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! What a cheap advert. Blatant propaganda) And you told us that all we had to do was to come down here and sit and listen to you and we’d be saved. (Stay alive in ’75) And now the church is gone and it’s all burned up and this stuff is gone, and we don’t have a prayer, and we don’t have a chance, and you fooled us!” And they’re going to finish off whose left. (Pretentious ravings!)
And they’re going to find the college professors. “You told us that if we listened to you, we will have earth’s good things. (That’s it. Knock further education and put an appeal to fear spin on it) And now the stock market has crashed, money is of no value. (Something the WBT$ is now finding out. Why do the WBT$ dabble in hedge funds, randcam shares, Philip Morris Tobacco, dabbling…in fact getting cash from anywhere!) You told us that if we just get this education we’ll have good in life. (That’s it. Knock further education and put an appeal to fear spin on it) And now we have no treasures stored up with God and we’re facing this great thing called Armageddon that Jehovah’s witnesses talked about all along.” And they’re going to finish them off.
There will be no light.
(Got to stop. I’m about to retch my guts up!)
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Mary
They have no sanctity or feeling toward the religious clergy, they're cutting and slashing them in the face in New York.
Um, did this really happen? Any media links to back it up or is it just the normal trying-to-scare-the-shit-out-of-everyone tactic?
They're breaking into convents and robbing the nuns, raping the nuns if you will.
WTF? Is this guy for real? Where is he coming up with this crap?
They're even breaking into churches and robbing them, they're robbing preachers on the streets.
Giving Herd the benefit of the doubt here and assuming this really happened, breaking into a religious place and robbing them is nothing new. If memory serves, grave robbers broke into the Pyramids of Giza and stripped them bare over 3,000 years ago. Was that also a "sign of the times?"
Punk, I couldn't even read the whole thing it was so utterly nauseating. Although I laughed my ass off at your comments! Actually, this talk sounds eerily like the ones they had in the build up to '75. Same shit, different speaker.
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punkofnice
Brothers, when that time comes, will you be ready for it? Will you have something to say that’s worthwhile? Will you have proof at that time that you have been running the race correctly? Why is that such an important question? (Multiple ‘appeals to fear’) Because the Bible says, go back to verse 29 and then verse 30. (Appeal to authority) Just as quickly as the sun, moon and stars become dark the Bible says, “And then the sign of the Son of man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in lamentation.” Now what is this appearance of the Son of man in the heavens? It is the same thing that is spoken of in Matthew chapter 25. Turn over to verse 31. Same thing. It says, “When the Son of man arrives in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit down on his glorious throne. (verse 32) And all the nations will be gathered before him” including Jehovah’s witnesses, (Where does it say that? Appeal to authority, appeal to fear, Us vs: THEM propaganda) “and he will separate people one from another, just as a shepherd separates the sheet from the goats.” And why? Turn back to chapter 24. Evidently, (Weasel alert) even people of the world (loaded language) will know and understand that they are in the final judgment period, and they will see something that will be evident; they will come to discern something that will be evident that this is it! And they will cry and they will weep. (Appeal to fear along with massive mystical manipulation) Why? Because this will not be a time where they can make any adjustments, have any Bible studies, have any return visits, or have any change in the judgments that are about to be rendered. (Oh, no! How will the WBT$ report it’s stats?)
Are you ready for that brothers? Do you understand what that actually means? (Obviously the speaker doesn’t) Once that sign of the Son of man appears in the heavens, where Jesus sits down on his glorious throne, he will judge you and I at that point in history as to whether or not you are actually a sheep or a goat. You and I will not be able to adjust or to modify or to rearrange the outcome of that judgment at that particular time. You will not be able to say to Jesus, “Oh Jesus, wait a minute, I’m disfellowshipped. (loaded language) Wait a minute, let me get reinstated.” Oh no! Oh no! You see, all the evidence will have been brought into the court as to who you are and what you are as a person. And once he sits down, you will not be able to change your record. Not one iota! (Appeal to authority and fear)
So can you say, “Well Jesus, you know, I was an irregular publisher. (Advert to do MORE) Give me a little time, let me…” No! “I meant to turn my…” No! “I meant to…” No! “I..” No! Because everything at that point, once it hits, everything that you were from here back will be dragged into that courtroom and Jesus will judge it right then and right there, and you and I will not be able to alter that situation. Not one iota! It will be finished! The judgment will be rendered, it will be cut and dry. You will either be a sheep or a goat. You will not be able to make any adjustment to the judgment. Serious business! Are you ready for that? (Appealing heavily to fear in an attempt to get the JWs to do MORE MORE MORE)
What are you training yourself to be now ? (A ‘mentally diseased apostate’ thanks for asking!) What kind of person are you now? (Non judgmental, average person not spouting propaganda designed to trap people into an antichrist pyramid big business posing as a religion with a brand named god, to get power and money for the leaders) Are you trying to get as close to the world (Loaded language) as you possibly can? By looking like them? (It’s better than looking like a second rate salesman in a polyester suit. Actually his statement is a fallacy of overgeneralization. What do people who are ‘worldly’ look like?) And acting like them? (Yes. I’m going to be a UN NGO whilst gambling ‘hedge funds’ and getting money via Philip Morris Tobacco and RandCam) Once Jesus sits down on his judgment throne, you will not be able to say, “Oh let me take this stuff off…” Nope! Nope! You had it on then, you have it on now. (What’s he rambling on about now?) That’s the way you were then, this is the way you’re going to be judged as you stand. (I pity the GB then!) What evidence you brought into that courtroom, between now and when Jesus sits down on his throne, that is the evidence that will be stacked up, (UN NGO, RandCam, Philip Morris Tobacco, Hedge funds, No Blood transfusions, Protecting Paedos etc etc) and that will be the determining factor as to whether we are sheep or goats. Understand that brothers. Understand that.
Let me illustrate that another way. (Oh please don’t. This is whacky enough as it is) Have you ever seen these advertisements where they have these muscle men, they show you this picture and they say “Your body can look like this.” They give you the idea that if you just lift up a few weights, if you go on a diet and eat some food, that you will have these big bulging muscles or you have this shapely trim. Don’t even think that you want to believe that! Because those people that you see in those pictures – it literally takes years before they can come to acquire a shape like that. (Ellwood, listen mate. It’s called propaganda and you should know this because the WBT$ is adept at it. The promise of a paradise on Earth by 1975?) It takes years of serious training and meticulous dieting. Those pictures that you see don’t imagine take it takes just a couple of days or a few weeks of dieting. Years! Years!
(I’m stopping here. This bloke is a nightmare. I wouldn’t want to be him. I’m surprised he doesn’t walk around with a tin fiol cap on so the demons can’t read his dirty little thoughts! OK. I’m using ‘ad hominem’ but what the hey!)