Do you see how far off the reservation Christianity can go?
A Question About Satan (For Those Who Believe In The Bible)
by Philadelphia Ponos 19 Replies latest watchtower bible
-
-
Larsinger58
Satan is a specific angel who had a high position in heaven who rebelled against God.
Satan was a unique angel who was considered the most beautiful of all angels. Satan was created to be the "wife" of Michael, the archangel, who later became Jesus Christ.
The two angels and their specifical relationship in heaven are depicted by the two "covering cherubs" whose wings cover the ark of the covenant. Thus Satan and Jesus were once married in heaven to each other. Once Satan rebelled and was kicked out of Mount Zion, God replaced Jesus' wife with the "144,000" (actually 1,440,000--another topic). That is, Christ's new "Bride", which is the church, replaces Satan in that position.
So Satan is a real angel, a rebel and Jehovah uses Satan right to the end to test mankind.
In the bigger scheme of things, though, God did create angels with free moral agency, so a chance to choose whether to love God and live or rebel and eventually die was an inevitability for some angels. Unfortunately, this incredibly beautiful and high-ranking angel was one of the ones who rebelled. God is reflected in the qualities of Love, Justice, Wisdom and Power. The only thing Satan ends up understanding is "power." That is, for whatever God is, God has the POWER and thus the right to have the universe as he chooses. So no matter what Satan and the other rebels might think of God, they are still forced to recognize this absolute power and right to terminate their lives if he wishes. Satan made his/her choice. God has accepted that but has moved on.
LS
-
TTWSYF
Really Larsinger38? Satan was Michael's wife? The bible specifies that angels are neither male nor female and they do not have spouses. As for Jesus being Michael, you could look to what the scriptures say and I quote from the NWT for your benefit. I personally like how the WTS uses capital letters in their 'version'.
IS 9; 6 For there has been a child born to us, there has been a son given to us; and the princely rule will come to be upon his shoulder. And his name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.
You may have been joking with your post, I don't know...if you were...good one!
dc
-
ShadesofGrey
As a newborn, I can't learn everything at once. I came here looking for answers, rather than to give my own.
This is pretty much the extent of my knowlege on the subject of Satan:
Hebrews 2: 14 Therefore, since the “young children” are sharers of blood and flesh, he also similarly partook of the same things, that through his death he might bring to nothing the one having the means to cause death, that is, the Devil; 15 and [that] he might emancipate all those who for fear of death were subject to slavery all through their lives.
I have assumed that there is only one Satan, since I take God at his word, and the Bible says one, in more places than this.
Shades
-
cofty
There is no concept of satan in the OT pre-exile. The dualistic worldview of zoroastrianism influenced the Jews in Babylon.
Compare who caused David to take a census in Chronicles with the earlier pre-exile account in Kings.
First Yahweh did it and then in the re-write after the exile all the bad stuff got blamed on his nemesis
-
poopsiecakes
So Satan is a real angel, a rebel and Jehovah uses Satan right to the end to test mankind.
Wow, Jehovah is a real piece of work huh?
-
Larsinger58
There is no concept of satan in the OT pre-exile. The dualistic worldview of zoroastrianism influenced the Jews in Babylon.
Compare who caused David to take a census in Chronicles with the earlier pre-exile account in Kings.
First Yahweh did it and then in the re-write after the exile all the bad stuff got blamed on his nemesis
ROFL! This is ridiculous. Satan and his followers are the "woman and her seed" in Genesis 3:15. Paganism recognized the "woman and her seed" as aspects of the Mother Goddess, specifically VIRGO who comes out of early Sumeria assigning a constellation to this goddess. The constellation of VIRGO appears to be a woman holding a branch. The branch represents the woman's seed or lineage (i.e. family tree), essentially representing Satan and his/her followers.
Further, Jewish paganism clearly links LILITH to Satan and the serpent, and Rennaisance art, even in the Sistine Chapel, reflect Satan as a snake-woman. So even way back before Babylonian captivity, the Jews had a concept of Satan as a demoness in a relationship with Adam. It gets all confused, but basically the marriage between Satan and Christ comes through more in paganism than in distorted Christian interpretation, although the two covering cherubs over the ark of the covenant are OT concepts of Satan and Christ/Michael.
In the Bible, Satan is an angel who will die after the 1000-year reign and his last chance at getting mankind to rebel against God.
Don't believe everything you read from those who lack knowledge or insight into mythicism and occult esotericism.
Satan is the mother goddess in pagan cultures and is depicted as a snake-woman in esoteric Christian artwork. Google "Lillith Sistine Chapel" to see lots of artwork showing Satan as a woman.
LS
-
cofty
Satan and his followers are the "woman and her seed" in Genesis 3:15.
Says who?
-
TTWSYF
Phili Ponos, I think that you're in the minority because Christians are in the minority. People believe in Satan [as a being and as a spirit] because of the church and the holy bible. Maybe other people in this forum believe in Satan but are working through the why[?].
LS is right that there is no specific mentioning of Satan in pre-exile OT, but he's there still, isn't he. If not his direct hand, certainly his spirit. Cain and Able? Didn't Cain have an accusing spirit when he killed his brother?
When Jesus told Peter, 'get behind me Satan', was he addressing the fallen angel or an accusing spirit? Is it possible that there are two meanings for Satan? I think so as Lucifer BECAME Satan, not the other way around, right?
Other fallen angels are mentioned by name in the scriptures. In catholic bibles the book of Tobit is an accepted OT book. The angel Raphael announces that HE is one of the seven who stands before the Lord after he chases down and bounds the demon Asmodeus. Short and interesting story if you've never read it.That story touches on LS's points about Lililth in so much that the demon lusts after the girl and kills seven of her suiters before the hero [Tobit, the younger] shows up. The problem with Lililth and the scriptures is that, well, she's just not there. Never mentioned, and the fact that some sects of Judiasm practice paganism proves nothing. Plenty of Christian sects twist and distort many truths and still call themselves Christians. They're not, so it means nothing.
As a Christian, I do not look to Madonna for instruction in Kabbalah to help with my Christianity. I look to people who know the truth and share it. Proof that is confirmed in the scriptures, as opposed to contridiction.
respectfully,
DC
-
ShadesofGrey
Nice to see you DC.
The devil is a spirit. Spirits work in ways we don't fully understand.
Satan is a name. Names in the Bible are often used in ways differently than we are used to.
So... yes there is one devil. Could it be that the name Satan does not always apply to him, but rather works as an adjective at times?
