Thanks Phillyfesters, we had a great time!

flower

At least my son and I did, I'm assuming the rest of ya'll did too . It was really great to meet you all in person and talk without the use of my fingers lol. I hope you liked the place, I did but I won't be going back there without a disguise! LOL. Looking forward to 1a.

For those of you who weren't there you'll never guess what happened at the restaurant. Were there talking about various things mostly related to our shared Watchtower experiences and our waitress walks up behind me and taps me on my shoulder and asks if I'm a witness. She caught me way off guard and I'm stammering around for the right answer.

Apparently, she overheard certain JW words in our conversations. I finally just say something like 'not anymore' or something like that. She says that she is a witness and starts telling me how familiar I look and so I ask her what hall she goes to and she names an area that would have to be the same KH that my sister goes to currently but maybe not the same congregation because I think there are several sharing a hall.

She asks if we are all da'd and so I told we were. The way she asked it was like she was kinda surprised that we were clean-cut, well groomed, polite people and not wild heathens with horns sprouting from our heads. Or perhaps she was just surprised to find a whole group of xjws together. I think it would be a strange site for a witness to see.

When she asks me my sisters name and I told her I would prefer not to share it she tried to assure me that she wouldnt say anything to anyone because she had 'been where I am' and had been df'd before.

It was really wierd to say the least. I mean of all the tons of restaurants in the area and all the waitresses in that place she happened to be ours. If we were all not so shocked I'm sure one of us would have done something intelligent like told her a couple of the reasons we are no longer jw's. As it is we didnt plant any seeds of doubt except perhaps the fact that all xjw's are crazy, demon possesed people.

But other than that we had a really nice time.

happy man

perhaps it was Jehova who try to see if you where like the lost son???
th

flower

Oh yea I'm sure that was it. Thanks happy man, whatever would we do without your contributions to the board?

flower

happy man

Oh, thank you, i think you is a littel joker my friend, but where is tuvalu?
Never heard of it.

Bodhisattva

While it took a moment to get it through my thick head what was going on, I know I restrained myself from 'preaching' to the waitress, not wanting to set off her automatic ApostoShield, although I did find myself thinking of a field service-like presentation later. Naturally the witness custom of shutting off, devaluing, or denying anything negative about their god, the WTS and its GB, was a major topic of discussion.

Some of us there had chosen not to formally DA, although it was brought out that it is mostly an effort to save relationships that are already dead. Even without DA'ing, family and friends still stop associating with those who don't continue meetings and service. The jw-media.org assertion that "those who simply cease to be involved are not shunned" is a crock; as had been said many times, there is no honorable way to leave.

We talked about leaving and its complications: Dealing with family, especially trying to turn a mate away from the bOrg, how hard attending meetings is after learning the truth about the truth - especially if you have to get there early to see to "privileges" or have to give talks, and how much more you hope for not-at-homes now that you realize you really are wasting peoples' time rather than saving their lives. (Although with the recent evidence that excessive sleep shortens life spans, maybe stopping them from sleeping in on a Saturday morning really is a public service!)

We also talked about what lead us out, what the final straw was. I think I have the key points below, and they should encourage those working through this site, where so many of these straws were first found:

- disfellowshipping
- blood contradictions
- UN NGO status
- the 1995 twist on the 1914 "generation"
- recognizing out own cognitive dissonance
and refusing to lie to ourselves anymore
to protect a business venture

All of us were turned off by organized religion, but felt that some of what the Society teaches is right. In my opinion and experience, it is good to visit other churches and see just how much more Christian they act then the Society taught us to expect, as well as to be exposed to different interpretations and many of the same good teachings without the mask of uniqueness.

We all had a good time and want to do it again. It is good to meet others in person who are in the same boat. It helps overcomes a lot of paranoia we all have.

For the future, especially for a larger group, the restaurant should be willing to seat folks without confirming a full party. Fortunately last night some of us knew each other so that we all linked up. Also perhaps reservations should be under a name that is easy for restaurant to get right even while it screams apostasy - like "Rutherford."

Love,

Bodhisattva

P.S. Entry in this month's KM - "Our Kuffar* Ministry":

What is someone says, "I was disfellowshipped but I found my way back to the Truth(TM)"?
Ask, "While you were disfellowshipped, how did your friends and family feel about being required to shun you?"
If the Witness answers, "Well, it was hard for them," ask "Didn't Paul say that God's Law is written in the hearts of mankind? So if shunning you troubled their conscience, which is out of alignment, their hearts or the shunning policy?"
If the Witness answers, "They had no problem whatsoever shunning me. In fact, they're still rather cold per the Society's recommendations to not be too accepting of a newly reinstated one, and its clear that their love is fully conditional on my allegience to a corporation," try to place a copy of Crisis of Conscience.

* The Islamic term Kuffar = Apostates

Edited for typos and some formatting.

flower

HAhaha! you are too funny Bod! I love the 'Kuffar Ministry' entry...too funny. When I used to go in service I was bad and hardly ever prepared a presentation. I would read the inside cover of the mag after my intoduction and as they say 'let the magazines place themselves'. Think that would work with C of C? lol.

Sorry you had to wait so long, next time we'll get that straightened out with the restaurant ahead of time. That place was packed last night..glad we made reservations anyway cause we may have been waiting all night for a table.

Nice meeting you and look forward to talking with you a bit more the next time.

flower

Happy man,

I could tell you but then I'd have to kill you.

flower

Joyzabel

Flower, glad you guys had a good time.

Don't dwell on what you could have/should have said to your waitress. Having a good time with new friends was the reason for getting together.

Can't wait to meet you this summer and create our own fun memories!

j2bf

badwillie

Hey Flower,
I didn't see this thread you started before I posted mine this morning. We really enjoyed getting to know you too - and your son is a real cutie! Looking forward to PhillyPhest II.
-BW.

refiners fire

Hehe.
Good on you flower. You are one of us "Evil" and "Satanic" ones now.
How does it feel? Not so bad is it.
I'll bet the waitress thing spun you out considering youre a newbie apostate. Dont worry, youll get used to it and soon enough will see that its THEM who are the hypocrites. Not you.
Story....(about hypocrisy):
There was this dub, I was DF and he lived in the flat opposite me.
Anyway, he NEVER spoke to me cause I was DF. One day he comes up to me in the driveway all smiles and shakes my hand like a long lost pal.
Guess what?
He wanted me to help get him a job in the place I worked at.
Sure enough I put in a word for him and he got the job.
Soon as he started working there, he went back to ignoring me as a DF person!
Hows that for hypocrisy??
Youll see lots of things like that from here on in.

Thanks Phillyfesters, we had a great time!

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