Tolerance

by Chariklo 20 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Chariklo

  In another thread, someone wrote, about another religion,

  Actually I don´t care about this religion. I just don´t want it my country. Why should I tolerate those, who are intolerant???

  The poster was talking about Islam, (Moslems).

  When I was at school, in the UK, which I think is where the poster above also lives, we had a set of History textbooks entitled "The Four Freedoms". These were Freedom from Want, Freedom from Fear, Freedom of Education and Freedom of Religion. That course of history, intended for children aged roughly 11-16, saw history as a gradual progress towards these freedoms. Thus in 1689, Parliament passed the Act of Toleration, outlining the importance of and the uplholding and protecting of relgious freedom, and further in 1829 it passed the Catholic Emancipation Act, ensuring that it truly extended to all groups at that time.

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Catholic_Relief_Act_1829
  
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Act_of_Toleration_1689

  I don't think this is irrelevant to a board for ex or wounded Jehovah's Witnesses. The Watchtower, par excellence, demonstrates an organisation that. above all, proclaims its ownership of God's truth, and actively tries to hook in people from other religions.

  I'm posting this here because I do think tolerance is important. If we don't uphold and practice religious toleration, i.e. the freedom for each and all to believe in and practise their own religion, then we become inward-looking bigots. After all, the Holocaust is recent history, and shoows what happens when prejudice takes control.

  I've been a little alarmed at the anti-Muslim sentiments noticeable at the moment on one or two threads. Whilst although I don't agree with these sentiments and would choose to uphold the right of free expression of opinion, I do urge people to think long and hard. Yes, the world does suffer from terrorism, and some of that terrorism does come from active Muslims, but it doesn't follow that all Muslims are like that. I personally know some extremely wise and gentle Moslems.

  The WT's own prejudices and controlling mindset has hurt most people here, or we wouldn't be here. I for one don't want to become like that in any way.

  Let's be tolerant, not prejudiced.

  Just my two penn'orth.
• 

  Fernando

  Indeed Chariklo!

  If we continue to recognise the illegitimate walls of sectarian division (religion) that compartmentalise humans into hostile and incompatible factions we are simply playing by Watchtower rules derived from the "god of religion" (Satan the Devil).

  Christians, Jews and Muslims claim to submit to the "God of Abraham" and therefore that Abraham is their earthly spiritual father. Ironically scripture does not recognise the false (Watchtower and religious) concept of various faithS. Ephesians 4:5 explicitly says there is only "one faith" namely that of Abraham.

  This faith (a wide opening of our spiritual eyes) follows a hearing of the unabridged "gospel" message known in Hebrew as "bissar" and in Arabic/Urdu as "Injeel"/"Injil" (Romans 10:16,17).

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_prophets_of_Abrahamic_religions

  http://injil.org/Kalimatullah/revelations.html
• 

  tec

  Good post, Chariklo. Few people in the past ever thought that they were being racist, intolerant and unjust at the time. You have to be able to see past the fear-mongering and the politics and the media, or we just keep washing and repeating; thinking this time is different.

  Peace,

  Tammy
• 

  Chariklo

  Fernando, thank you very much indeed for posting those links. They've opened for me a fascinating door into a world of knowledge almost completely new to me.

  I'd always felt that poor Ishmael was badly treated, and Hagar too.

  If we continue to recognise the illegitimate walls of sectarian division (religion) that compartmentalise humans into hostile and incompatible factions we are simply playing by Watchtower rules derived from the "god of religion" (Satan the Devil).

  This is interesting too. I completely agree with the sentiment, and I'm very interested that you call Satan the "god of religion". Where does that concept come from, please?

  It became clear to me on Thursday evening, after I'd failed to suppress the growing inner feeling that what the Watchtower teaches is definitely not of God, that this same WT is in fact doing the work of the very Devil it professes to oppose. It divides. It's arrogant. While admitting that all people are imperfect, they use that fact as an excuse to cover up any observed failings, and at the same time go on about "Jehovah's righteous standards" to which everyone must strive. (I'm sick of hearing that phrase, by the way.)

  How very different from Jesus' insistence that it was not the Pharisee who prayed ostentatiously that God loved but the poor sinner at the back who was shamed of what he'd done and said "Lord, have mercy on me, a sinner".

  Thanks very much for your input. And thanks, Tammy, too. You're right. Fearmongering is rampant today, and it's absolutely not because the world belongs to Satan and Jehovah is going to come and wreak retribution any moment now. Truly, who would want to believe in or follow a deity who acted in that way? The WT's Jehovah is scarecely portrayed as a God lof Love!
• 

  leavingwt

  Chariko,

  What do you think of Pat Condell's opinion on the matter?

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uTypnaP5X4
• 

  Chariklo

  Hi Leavingwt,

  Well, I've just watched the video. He's very vehement. To be honest, I hadn't heard of Pat Condell before, so I Googled him to try to find out where he's coming from. The content of his talk didn't make clear why he felt that Christianity and Islam treated him with...did he say contempt? I don't think I'm much clearer, but Wikipedia says he's an articulate, militant atheist, so maybe he's talking about things from an atheist point of view.

  I'm still not sure that either religion treats atheists exactly with contempt, so I feel a bit at a loss.

  What do I think? I think, on the whole, that my first posting on this says it all. I dislike prejdice. I dislike discourtesy. I think that people should be free to worship or not as they think fit.

  Reflecting, this evening, I've decided that Jehovah's Witnesses live in a prison. The gaolers do their best to make the imates not only happy to be there but to try very hard to get others to give up their freedoms willingly.

  Crazy.
• 

  I Want to Believe

  Well, this is a board dedicated to breaking free from a restrictive religion. I'm no expert, but from what I've heard of Islamic law, even the gentle type, it ia a very restrictive set of rules that come from a dubious "theocratic" source. And there are plenty of wise and gentle JWs, but nobody really wants them around here either.
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  leavingwt

  "I think that people should be free to worship or not as they think fit."

  Unfortunately, that leaves room from violence, misogyny, genital mutilation, sexual assault and emotional abuse. When I criticize and ridicule such things, those who practice them will most certainly view my opinions as discourteous. Perhaps they can tolerate me.

  If adults want to harm themselves, so be it. When they seek to harm others, good people are obligated to be discourteous, IMHO.
• 

  Retrovirus

  Hi Chariklo, nice to see you posting again!

  From your first post:

  The Watchtower, par excellence, demonstrates an organisation that. above all, proclaims its ownership of God's truth, and actively tries to hook in people from other religions

  I think you're being too kind to the wt by omission. It also targets, insults and misrepresents other religions. I was quite shocked when my jw ladies googled my religion (fine) only to look for "errors".

  I want to believe I think all religions have rules that come from a dubious "theocratic" source (yes, mine included ). The rules is where they differ. As with Christianity, Judaism and buddhism, Islam has fanatical, restrictive sects, liberal sects and middle-of the-road ones.

  The trouble begins only when we can be convinced that other people should be persuaded or constrained to live by our rules.
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  Violia

  I can't post on that "scum in Britain " thread but the video's were frighting. Sad to see Britain being taken over . No wonder Tim Minchin has so many references to Islam in his comedy.