Questions for Evolutionists

by RWC 29 Replies latest jw friends

  • RWC
    RWC

    It appears that alot of people on this board believe in evolution (either by that name or by another) as the explanation for the origins of life. To those people I would sincerely ask the following:

    1. Where did plants come from?

    2. Where did the DNA come from to make animals?

    3. Why aren't molds and other simple celled life forms continuing to evolve into more complex life forms?

    4. Why aren't entirely new creatures being evolved today from other ones that already exist?

    5. What is the fossil evidence to support the change from one animal to another as opposed to a different variation of the same animal?

    If there are no answers to these questions, than aren't you believing in something that you think will be figured out in the future and thus you are exhibiting faith in the unkown?

  • Amazing
    Amazing

    Hi RWC: Visit the site at: http://www.talkorigins.org/ It is good at presenting various views and scientific understanding of Evolution. The best challenge I have read to date regarding "evolution", with respect to its unanswered questions, is "Darwin's Black Box" by Michael Behe. He is a Biochemist who does not dispute all of evolution, nor does he push the phoney unscientific agruments of Creationists-Fundies, but he does raised good points as a matter of science. Behe does expose how some evolutionists and creationists miss the points. He shows how some in each camp fail to address science. He is not arrogant.

    AlanF and JanH will do a much better job of answering your questions with greater detail. Here are my short responses to your questions:

    First, just for the record, the "Theory of Evolution" does not mean that it is an unproven science waiting for answers at some future date. Comparitively, "Electrical Theory" likewise does not mean that 'electricity' or our knowledge of its laws are unproven. Rather the use of 'Theory' is to identify the working understanding of a process, from which a body of 'laws' and practical apllication is made. Theory in science does not mean unproven 'speculation' but rather the premise or basis on which we describe a process. Therefore, evolution has been established ... but like other matters of science, it is growing, evidence is continuing to mount, and revisions are being made.

    Secondly, understanding and accepting 'evolution' does not require one abandon faith in God. One can believe that God designed and initiated the process of 'evolution' to achieve his physical creation of the universe and life itself. Evolution is not about proving or disproving God, since that is not possible ... rather 'evolution' is about studying evidence and how that evidence relates to all life on this planet. Evolution supports other related sciences, including the medical field ... and as our knowledge of evolution has advanced, so have related sciences.

    You asked,

    "1. Where did plants come from?"
    They developed-evolved.

    "2. Where did the DNA come from to make animals?"
    DNA is part of the evolutionary development. In fact, because of our current understanding of DNA and the recent completion of the genome Project, science can now trace our origins with greater clarity and positively link us to ancestors in the animal kingdom.

    "3. Why aren't molds and other simple celled life forms continuing to evolve into more complex life forms?"
    Who say they are not evolving? The process of evolution often takes a long time. Also, the basis for change (another word for evolution) needs to be there. Your question could be asked about almost any life form on earth. Some evolutionary developments have been much faster and observable, especially in the world of viruses and bacteria, while others are very slow, stop, reverse, and then take off again. Some life forms simply go extinct.

    "4. Why aren't entirely new creatures being evolved today from other ones that already exist?"
    Who says they are not? The time clock is so slow that you wuld not notice the 'change' in you lifetime, nor in several lifetimes. But, taken snapshots over thousands and hundreds of thousands of years, and we would see "change."

    "5. What is the fossil evidence to support the change from one animal to another as opposed to a different variation of the same animal?"
    Fossil evidence is much stronger than many have been led to believe. But this is where I am weak on the topic. However, I understand that now science relies far less on the fossil record, and much more on other evidentiary avenues to demonstrate the workings of evolution.

    You concluded:

    "If there are no answers to these questions, than aren't you believing in something that you think will be figured out in the future and thus you are exhibiting faith in the unkown?"
    No. There are answers now. The body of evidence is strong and continuing to mount in favor of 'evolution aka change'. And it is not something waiting to be figured out in the future. There are unanswered questions, and new questions emerge as old ones are answered or disgarded.

    Evolution, unlike religion, is a field of science, based on the scientific methods of observation, measurement, testing, collection of evidence, and study. It is not about "belief" or "Faith." Our understanding of the process of 'change or evolution' will itself change over time, as evidence continues to be collected, and as science improves its ability to understand via its tools to test and measure and observe.

  • indireneed
    indireneed

    With evolution, it is important to remember that it is not fact, but rather a scientific revelation. It could be wrong, or it could be right. However, there is no disputing that there is evidence that contradicts a 7-day (or any number under several billion) creation of the earth.

    To me, the changes that we see in everday life are evolution. For example, species 'change' or evolve to inhabit their surroundings. One species learns how to adapt to a new situation, and this is evolution.

    Also, look at wisdom teeth. Some people have them now, but some people don't. Why is this? Because there is no space in the mouth. Our ancestors had wisdom teeth, and they fit. So why is this changing? Because of our diet. Because we are changing, our bodies are changing.

    This is not simply 'chance' - it is rather dynamic evolution occuring as we chew our food . . .

  • Xander
    Xander

    I think that's the biggest mistake creationists make.

    They assume 'evolution' means one day a group of monkeys started giving birth to humans.

    No one is suggesting that. Evolution is a slow process of change. At some point, some group of primates started growing less hair, started standing upright. Over generations and generations, their brains became larger.

    A big part of the problem is our language. Looking at one animal, we say 'chimpanzee', at another 'human'. How different are they REALLY? How many changes does the chimpanzee's physiology have to go through before we call it something else? Evolution is about all those changes that go along the way - not just the name change! (As most creationists seem to believe).

    Since this is a JW board, I'll go ahead and forward that the 'Creation' book is one of the worst pro-creation books I've ever seen - it's poorly written, poorly researched, and likes to draw conclusions out of thin air.

    A fanatic is one who, upon losing sight of his goals, redoubles his efforts.
    --George Santayana
  • Nemesis
  • Xander
    Xander

    Important read:

    http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/evolution-definition.html

    Defining what 'evolution' is. I kind of was heading this way above - in short, most of what creationists have a problem with is misunderstanding what 'evolution' is.

    Highlights of the article:
    It is important to note that biological evolution refers to populations and not to individuals and that the changes must be passed on to the next generation. In practice this means that,

    Evolution is a process that results in heritable changes in a population spread over many generations.

    and...

    When someone claims that they don't believe in evolution they cannot be referring to an acceptable scientific definition of evolution because that would be denying something which is easy to demonstrate. It would be like saying that they don't believe in gravity! (emphasis added)

    A fanatic is one who, upon losing sight of his goals, redoubles his efforts.
    --George Santayana
  • Xander
    Xander

    And, here is another link that actually answers many of the questions you brought up:

    http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-misconceptions.html

    A fanatic is one who, upon losing sight of his goals, redoubles his efforts.
    --George Santayana
  • Amazing
    Amazing

    Hi Indireneed: You said,

    "With evolution, it is important to remember that it is not fact, but rather a scientific revelation. It could be wrong, or it could be right."

    This is incorrect. Just as 'electrical theory' is establish with facts and know constants, so is evolution established. What remains are unanswered questions, just as we still have unanswered questions about 'electircal theory' or 'gravitational theory' or know phenomenon in the universe.

    You noted,

    "To me, the changes that we see in everday life are evolution. For example, species 'change' or evolve to inhabit their surroundings. One species learns how to adapt to a new situation, and this is evolution."
    These little changes also affect the nature of a species, along with many other factors ... and over eons of time, these changes can and do result in branches of species and eventually totally different species.

    Interesting point you made about 'wisddom' teeth.

  • Xander
    Xander

    And more good points along those lines:

    The misconception about the lack of transitional fossils is perpetuated in part by a common way of thinking about categories. When people think about a category like "dog" or "ant," they often subconsciously believe that there is a well-defined boundary around the category, or that there is some eternal ideal form (for philosophers, the Platonic idea) which defines the category. This kind of thinking leads people to declare that Archaeopteryx is "100% bird," when it is clearly a mix of bird and reptile features (with more reptile than bird features, in fact). In truth, categories are man-made and artificial. Nature is not constrained to follow them, and it doesn't.

    A fanatic is one who, upon losing sight of his goals, redoubles his efforts.
    --George Santayana
  • julien
    julien
    Why aren't molds and other simple celled life forms continuing to evolve into more complex life forms?

    This is like the question of a child who doesn't believe that humans grow old and die. "Why aren't I turning into an old man right now!!?" Additionally it seems to indicate you believe that one species completely changes into another "just because". This isn't what happens. Some members of a geographically widely spread species, for example mold or bacteria, might indeed change if local environmental pressure to change was there. Others would not change at all if they were already successful as is in their environment.

    A good book on this subject I am reading right now is Finding Darwin's God .. the author believes in God and believes belief in evolution can be reconciled with that. He addresses many creationist arguments including those of Behe mentioned by Amazing.

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