1975 Made Easy.

by Englishman 21 Replies latest jw friends

  • Englishman
    Englishman

    As I was one of those people who were around during the build-up to 1975, I thought that some of the newer converts might be interested to see how the society arrived at this date with such confidence.

    Firstly, we need to see how 1914 figures in this. We need to appreciate, that although the date 1914 is arrived at retrospectively - that is it was assumed initially to be the date of Armageddon, only later was it re-written as the date when Satan was thrown out of Heaven and Jesus ascended to his throne.

    The society tied this in with the scripture “This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur”, assumed that a “generation” was the average life-span of 70 years, tacked it onto 1914 to arrive at 1984 but also mentioned that some would live to 80 years owing to “special strength”, then mentioned that this generation would “by no means pass away” so that quite a wide time slot was available for Armageddon to arrive. This window of time then provided endless opportunities for JW’s to be kept in a permanent state of anticipation as various events unfolded. Armageddon was always, in my experience, never be more than 10 years away.

    In the mid 60’s various speakers at District assemblies began to introduce the idea that the 6000 years of “Man’s creation” was almost over, and that Armageddon would arrive when this time was up. This is how it worked:

    It was generally assumed that each creative day lasted for 7000years. Adam, the last creation, was created at the end of the sixth 7000 year day. According to JW’s, Adam was created in 4026 BC. Witnesses believe that the earth MUST be restored to it’s original paradise condition by the end of the last 7000 year day, God’s rest day. Add 7000 years to 4026 BC, allow for the fact that there was no year Zero and you finish up at 2975 AD. All that is now necessary is to accept the fact that it will take a millennium – 1000 years – for the clean up of earth and Armageddon survivors to be completed by 2975 AD. So now we take the 1000 years off this date to arrive at the time that this big clean up starts. Yup! 1975! Well within the "generation" of 1914 too!

    Easy eh? Armageddon MUST arrive by then if the last creative day finished in 4026 BC. Almost unbelievably, the Boyz ‘n Brooklyn never gave a thought to the fact that Adam was not God’s last creation. Or maybe he was, then he wasn’t. Whatever, when yet another prophecy failed to materialise, the society leapt on to the fact that we had no way of knowing when EVE was created. So this gave them some breathing space. Even then they committed themselves that Adam would probably have been on in his own for “Probably just months, not years”. Using that argument, Adam would have been at least 27 years old before Eve was created, we are in 2002AD, 27 years on from Adams’ supposed 6000th birthday.

    Since those days, the society has had virtually no comments to make about 1975, most dubs are now too young to know much about it all or too old to care. Only us silver fifty- sixty – somethings who have left the org, have any actual recollections about the sense of urgency and haste that permeated our lives back then. Whatever happens , please don’t fall for the dub line that “some believed something just might happen” in 1975. Everyone KNEW that 1975 was THE year. Anyone who claims otherwise is lying through their teeth!

    Englishman.

    Truth exists;only falsehood has to be invented. -Georges Braque

  • larc
    larc

    Englishman,

    All I can say is, "yeh, buddy" or "Amen brother Ben."

    Larc - of the been there, done that class.

  • LittleToe
    LittleToe

    Just a few more maths for you:

    {Taking the 4026 BC date, and the rest of the Genesis genealogical information as true, for the sake of conjecture}

    Adam was 130 when he fathered Seth, which is presented as occurring after Abel was murdered. Since Cain took a wife and fled, at this time, he must have been at least...??? 15 ???
    To round off the figures and to allow for pregnancies, etc. the smallest period of time must surely be about 20 years from the events in Eden to Seth's birth. Adam would be 110, at most, when he left Eden.

    Surely this would give a maximum time-stretch of 2085 AD before all traces of a {premillenial / 7000 year "day" incorporating the millenium} outlook could be obliterated?

    Ah, whatever...
    Sheesh!

  • Englishman
    Englishman

    Little Toe,

    See, even using your figures, it still doesn't ring true. If we assume that the dubs are correct, we know then that Adam is at least 27 years old until Eve comes into the picture. So he has seen every other creation mate and have offspring in this time! He is the only fella who ain't got a gal!

    Remember to, that the perfect creator is slowly coming to see that it's not good for Adam to be alone. This took 27 years? Lets assume then that Eve came along, ate the fruit after a quick chat with a serpent, and she and Adam are promptly given the old heave-ho. After 27 years with the animals Adam obeys a snake?

    Englishman

    Truth exists;only falsehood has to be invented. -Georges Braque

  • moman
    moman

    1975, what about 1975, who ever said that was going beyond what is written & running ahead of Jehovah.
    Its an Apostate scam!
    Oh, & by the way, please turn in your old publications, so they can be recycled. Jehovaha's people are not wastefull you know.

    P.S. STAY OF THE NET, its run by SATAN!

  • proplog2
    proplog2

    I talked to Karl Klein around 1980 and he described the situation at Bethel among the GB. They were razzing F.Franz early in 1975 about whether he still thought that was the year. Franz's response? "Just wait. It isn't October yet."

    So the GB behavior was basically ridicule toward Franz. Had us lowly ones voiced such confrontational doubt we would have been DF.

    I brought to Kleins attention that a lot of the rush marriages that took place anticipating 1975 were either going through divorce or unravelling. He noted that "well that's another problem we didn't think about".

  • avengers
    avengers

    Who the hell is this moman dude.

    1975, what about 1975, who ever said that was going beyond what is written & running ahead of Jehovah.
    Its an Apostate scam!
    I experienced 1975 firsthand; also the buildup to it. The idea about 1975, the calculations and the magazines and books about 1975 were all from the WT.
    DUH.

    The bigger the lie the more that will believe it.
    Adolph Hitler
    Truth cannot be changed. Man's understanding of truth however, can.
  • Amazing
    Amazing

    Hi Englishman: I love your post. You are 100% correct about the 1975 date. Also, the issue of Jubilie was involved. God created in 7,000 year increments called creative days. He rested on the 7th of these 7,000 year days. The Millenium would start at the end of 48 thousand years in 1975, and Christ's Kingdom rules ruring the 49th Thousand year ... or Grand Anti-typical Jubilee. Okay, enough of the technical stuff, now for some fun:

    You said, "Remember to, that the perfect creator is slowly coming to see that it's not good for Adam to be alone. This took 27 years? Lets assume then that Eve came along, ate the fruit after a quick chat with a serpent, and she and Adam are promptly given the old heave-ho. After 27 years with the animals Adam obeys a snake?"

    According to the Society, Fred Franz said in their book "Life Everlasting in Freedom of the Sons of God," 1966 English version, pages 45 to 47, paragraphs 22 through 24: "Before God created anything new, a woman, God left the man free to determine whether there was a suitable companion for him among all the lower animals."

    When I read this I spit out my coffee, and howeled. How in the name of hell did I miss that when I read the book? So, for God to leave a young man alone, without a woman, to explore animals for 27 years to try and find a suitable mate seems rather unusual, eh? But then, considering that Adam said, "At last, bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh," may suggest that even this perfect man was up to his eyeballs in high-charge testosterone, ready for action.

    So ... when the Society started talking about the time from Adam to Eve's creation ... as 1975 was upon us ... the end was not taking place ... we all felt that this "little" addition of time would be short, very short, perhaps a few years at most, taking us up to 1977 or 1978. The Speaker said at the Summer 1975 District Convention ... "Do not get lulled into thinking that this old system will go on another 10 years." Well, he was right, it went on another 27 years. Poor Adam, just unthinkable that he would have to try and figure out which animal he wanted ... sheep? ... Gorilla? ... baboon? and then after 27 years of holding his family jewels intact, Ahhhhhh ... Eve arrives ... and it only cost a night's sleep and a rib.

  • Stealth
    Stealth

    There are many who support JWs claim that the 1975 was not promoted by the WTBTS but the brothers and sisters made a bigger deal out of it than was actually promoted.

    I was just a pre-teen during these years and yet, for some reason I can remember the exact date: September 5 1975. I remember little else from those years let alone a specific date.

    I am not a very detailed person, I have trouble remembering my own childrens birth dates, yet this date is forever marked in my memory.

    I have not gone back and researched any of the old material on this subject, was this date September 5, 1975 actually published? Or did I make more out of it then was intended?

    -stealth

  • Marvin Shilmer
    Marvin Shilmer

    In September of 1968 at the public study of The Watchtower, all English speaking congregations of Jehovah's Witnesses in the United States and England were asked the following question:

    What may occur before 1975, but what attitude should we take?

    The correct answer to the first part of the question was:

    Armageddon.

    The correct answer to the second part of the question was:

    We will wait to see how closely the seventh thousand-year period of man’s existence coincides with the sabbathlike thousand-year reign of Christ, which seventh thousand-year period will run out within months of the Gregorian calendar year of 1975.

    What was the affect of statements like this? There was a literal frenzy of expectation that lead to many adults among Jehovah's Witnesses selling their homes and other assets to finish out the short time remaining. Quite a few of those [ex]publishers are still alive and living in a poverty stricken state because they were led to a conclusion that the end would come sooner than their liquidated assets would run out. Even children of Jehovah's Witnesses were influenced in this frenzy. Quite a few convinced their parents that they should drop out of school as soon as the law would allow, so they could pioneer. In some cases parents were convincing their children to this. The WTS did not discourage any of it. If anything they promoted the frenzy.[2]

    It galls me that some JWs of today talk as if all this frenzy was basically inconsequential or blown out of proportion. The WTS started and fed the frenzy! It's just that simple. For crying out loud, out in field service we were openly converting people by convincing them that 1975 was "It!"

    My own memories of this period run the gamut from supercharged Watchtower study articles, congregational and convention talks by WTS representatives, all trying to give scholarly and emotional license to a "Survive till 75" mentality. The WTS knew perfectly well that quite a few JWs at the time had "Armageddon by 75" thinking, and they fed it--big time.[3,2] I remember overseers having frequent discussion on and off the stage about how long the great tribulation would take and whether it should be expected to begin as early as 72 or 73, or whether it would be a relatively short-term affair that would happen the same year as Armageddon, in 1975. Talk like this was rampant, and it was all started and fed by the WTS. Those who do not admit this today are either ignorant or lying, to themselves and everyone else.

    [1]
    *** w68 8/15 499 Why Are You Looking Forward to 1975? ***
    30. What may occur before 1975, but what attitude should we take?

    30 Are we to assume from this study that the battle of Armageddon will be all over by the autumn of 1975, and the long-looked-for thousand-year reign of Christ will begin by then? Possibly, but we wait to see how closely the seventh thousand-year period of man’s existence coincides with the sabbathlike thousand-year reign of Christ. If these two periods run parallel with each other as to the calendar year, it will not be by mere chance or accident but will be according to Jehovah’s loving and timely purposes. Our chronology, however, which is reasonably accurate (but admittedly not infallible), at the best only points to the autumn of 1975 as the end of 6,000 years of man’s existence on earth. It does not necessarily mean that 1975 marks the end of the first 6,000 years of Jehovah’s seventh creative “day.” Why not? Because after his creation Adam lived some time during the “sixth day,” which unknown amount of time would need to be subtracted from Adam’s 930 years, to determine when the sixth seven-thousand-year period or “day” ended, and how long Adam lived into the “seventh day.” And yet the end of that sixth creative “day” could end within the same Gregorian calendar year of Adam’s creation. It may involve only a difference of weeks or months, not years.

    [2]
    *** km 5/74 3 How Are You Using Your Life? ***
    Yes, since the summer of 1973 there have been new peaks in pioneers every month. Now there are 20,394 regular and special pioneers in the United States, an all-time peak. That is 5,190 more than there were in February 1973! A 34-percent increase! Does that not warm our hearts? Reports are heard of brothers selling their homes and property and planning to finish out the rest of their days in this old system in the pioneer service. Certainly this is a fine way to spend the short time remaining before the wicked world’s end.—1 John 2:17.

    [3]
    *** w68 8/15 501 Why Are You Looking Forward to 1975? ***
    36 Even if one cannot see beyond 1975, is this any reason to be less active? The apostles could not see even this far; they knew nothing about 1975. All they could see was a short time ahead in which to finish the work assigned to them. (1 Pet. 4:7) Hence, there was a ring of alarm and a cry of urgency in all their writings. (Acts 20:20; 2 Tim. 4:2) And rightly so. If they had delayed or dillydallied and had been complacent with the idea the end was some thousands of years off they would never have finished running the race set before them. No, they ran hard and they ran fast, and they won! It was a life or death matter with them.—1 Cor. 9:24; 2 Tim. 4:7; Heb. 12:1.

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