Rev.14:3-5 Do you believe this to be literal or symbolic? Your thoughts.
by Kojack57 16 Replies latest jw friends
-
-
Londo111
Symbolic. It's in Revelation after all...
-
tec
Helps if you put in, I think :)
And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures and the elders. No one could learn the song e x cept the 144000 who had been redeemed from the earth. These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb. No lie was found in their mouths; they are blameless.
Which part? The 144000 or the 'keeping themselves pure'.
I think the 144000 is symbolic of a completeness. All 12 tribes, 12000 in each tribe (the 000 representing completeness). I think 'not defiling themselves with women' means not leaving God for other faiths/false gods/false prophets/religions, etc. Not literal women, and not literal virgins (as I know some translations use)
Peace,
tammy
-
Kojack57
Tammy: You are right I should have quoted the scripture. I really like your interpretation, makes sense. Thanks.
-
thetrueone
It better be symbolic or there's a lot anointed men who aren't virgins who are going to be really pissed , not to mention a lot
of anointed woman , they are totally out of the picture all together.
My mother in law says she's of the anointed, I think I will read her this scripture.
-
red21
John was probably on drugs...who knows. LOL! But they always said that they wrote things as they understood them back then or what made sense to them...so, a few thousand years later, we are left to figure it out. So, if they were inspired, why not inspire them to write in a way that THEY would not understand but WE would seeing as WE are the ones that were suppose to live the fulfillment? Why could John just write it down plainer...such he would not understand but we would? I still believe in many things we were taught...but I do struggle with WHY does it have to be so hard? Why has it taken thousands of years, people, books, religions, and wasted words to figure out? Why did Russel start in one direction and then end up in another and now 100 years later, we keep going in different directions? Why so dam hard? Why not make it so plain that EVERYONE can understand it and appreciate it and not need a hundred years of publications, talks, books, assemblies, aid/insight books, latin, greek, hebrew to figure it out? The Bible says he reveals it to the simple and uneducated but they cannot figure this out either unless someone educated tries to explain it to them? Seems ass backwards doesn't it?
-
mP
revelation was written by an angry very angry jew. he couldnt figure out why jehovah had abandoned his chosen ppl and let the godless romans destroy te temple in jerusalem. like all good jews he copied pagan myth and stories hence the hydra sorry dragon or babylon. the geast is nero, 666= nero etc. its not prophevy is just the sdtory of nero. lots of ppl believed nero returned hence the antichrust nonsense ...
-
designs
Singing in heaven is a very important part of each day.
-
Nambo
Another point to consider about the 12 tribes of Israel that the society says are symbolic as 11 of those tribes are no more, surely God himself knows the lineage of each and every person who ever lived.
Just because we dont know who or where the literal decendants of the promise to Abraham are, doesnt mean Jehovah doesnt know. And therefore the Great crowd could therefore be members of the "annointed" from amongst the Gentiles, an immeasurable amount.
-
Fernando
My thoughts were exactly what Tammy wrote so eloquently and diplomatically.
Furthermore, anyone can be part of the 144,000 and have the "one hope" (which includes access to heaven and earth).
However in the New Covenant scriptures there is only one "the anointed" (Ho Kristos in Greek) namely Christ, even in the corrupted NWT.
Of course the Holy Spirit anoints the spiritual eyes and ears of those receiving the message about Christ to convict them of dysfunction and how it is reversed in stages. They are also convicted of IMPUTED righteousness, holiness, sonship, friendship, sinlessness and eternal life, until the recreation when these will become ABSOLUTE instead.