"...baptizing them in the name of the Father and of Watchtower Society and of the holy spirit "

by irondork 13 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Band on the Run

  Baptism is not a legal status. It is no contract that is legally enforceable. Most people would call it a promise and promises alone are not contracts. Contracts are enforced by a court yet in North America and Western Europe no court will decide an internal religious dispute. My thinking of the reason for a letter is its pscychological impact. Just by giving it them, you are foolishly acknowledging their legitimacy. No one has ever been fined or imprisoned for walking away from JWs.

  There is no legal basis that I can think of for the letter. All you did at baptism was make a promise, one that is rescindable at will.

  The legal question is clear. What makes it difficult is the emotion toil and potential loss of famiy and friends. Perhaps we should call it a form of social contract. It is clear what the baptizee promises but what does the baptizer promise? I'm not aware of any negotiations. I view baptism as affirmation of a particular creed. What it means must vary with denomination.

  No legal duty but how I remember the threat of loss of love.
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  OldGenerationDude

  A major oversight of the JW religion is that it lacks spirituality.

  We do a lot of talking here, reasoning, discussing, and it's all good and healthy and should continue.

  One thing we don't do if we have come from under the Watchtower's shadow is discuss the mystical side or the experience of theophany or like spiritual matters. It's all scholastic. It's all very dry, like constantly having to pull out a ruler a measure everything that comes our way.

  Baptism in other religions is seen as something they call a "sacrament." It's not a symbol. It's not a legal contract. And it's not something that can be undone or repeated because of its sacramental value.

  Most of us would say we don't know a thing about sacramentality, and that's right. JWs don't have much beyond academic/scholastic discussions about Scripture. There are no "experiencing the divine" or any of that that comes from it. There's no contact with God by means of their religion like with others. It's just a way to pat yourself on the back that you are in the right religion, equipping yourself to tell others they aren't (another pat on the back for being able to do that), and more education to keep learning the circular reasoning mind-mush that gets cranked out constantly from that organization. No spirit or theophany at all.

  Band on the Run has it right that in many cases it's views as a "threat of loss of love." Where in most religions it is a happy time, with gifts, photos, pictures, celebration, custom, tradition, it is none of these. A sacrament (according to the belief) gives people a grace or physical contact with the spiritual by means of the spiritual species or elements used in the ritual.

  The JW experience? How boring. How sad. How dry.
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  Butterflyleia85

  Ding I wrote you back, you have a PM. sorry I wasn't able to get to you for a couple days, it's been pretty hecktic at home.

  I guess this "New Birth" is explained here: http://www.watchtower.org/e/20090401/article_05.htm

  They said they baptise in "water" and in "spirit".

  No different from how the main Christians believe really. The only difference is Holy Spirit to Jehovah's Witnesses is an "Active Force" not an actual "Beening". The water is a symbolically pure and clensing away sin or the old way in which we were born into as being imperferect, but when we emerge in water we have a "New Birth" or made new again reconized as Jesus follower! The whole process of baptism is a commetment to God, through Jesus Christ. That is how I understood it then and still now.

  The two questions asked by the Jehovah's Witnesses I feel is a commitment to them and to God! Totally different form what I mentioned above. I think they say it in public too because who would really have the guts to say NO! LOL

  Now I'm not really sure what you ment by rebaptism either. I know one has done that after getting DFed or yeah if someone from another religion was already baptized under their church they would be required to be baptised again... but that's the only two ways of rebaptism that I know of.
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  TTWSYF

  A number of years ago [like 20 or so] my brother and his wife were baptized into the WTS. I attended to support my bro with a camera and a big smile. I was surrounded by members who were trying to convert me or atleast encourage me to 'give it a try'. I was hounded so badly that I missed the ceremony and only got to take pics of my brother and sister in law exiting the dunking pool.

  I was dissapointed but my brother seemed fine with it.

  I now know why I was distracted by other members, for if I heard the baptism vows [in the name of the father, son and God's organization] I certainly would have protested to my family members. I didn;t realize until years after reading others speak of the JW baptism.

  What a huge crock of shit the JW baptism is. No scriptural validity at all. Fuc--ng disgrace!