Blood transfusion DF/DA

allyouneedislove

I was reading the following page:

http://ajwrb.org/currentwtpolicy/callingSociety.htm

Can a JW still be DF or DA for taking a blood transfusion, if they are not "repentant"?

leavingwt

JWs can be DF'd for anything that three elders agree upon, including accepting a blood transfusion.

My understanding is that it is still against the religion. If it is not covered by the various changes they have made to the blood doctrine, then a person is actually disassociating themselves. They are in effect saying I am no longer willing to go along with what God's organisation says. Particularly if they were baptised after 1985 when the baptism question included ' are you happy to be called a JW and work along with the spirit led organisation.'

diamondiiz

Some discussion on regarding blood here:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/members/private/224643/3/Help-HLC-member-coming

fugue

This was at the heart of the wt's deception in Bulgaria. The Bulgarian government didn't like that the witnesses sanctioned members based on their choice of medical treatment. So the wtbts deceptively changed their rules. Unrepentantly receiving a blood transfusion became an indication that the person was "disassociating himself." This allowed the wtbts to tell Bulgaria: No, we do NOT sanction anyone for their choice of medical treatment. (Of course, the end resut is still the same... if a person was found to unrepentantly accept blood, he would be announced as "no longer one of jw's.")

Pre-Bulgaria blood policy:
*** w61 1/15 p. 63 Questions From Readers ***
Questions From Readers
? In view of the seriousness of taking blood into the human system by a transfusion, would violation of the Holy Scriptures in this regard subject the dedicated, baptized receiver of blood transfusion to being disfellowshiped from the Christian congregation?
The inspired Holy Scriptures answer yes.
...
If, however, he refuses to acknowledge his nonconformity to the required Christian standard and makes the matter an issue in the Christian congregation and endeavors to influence others therein to his support; or, if in the future he persists in accepting blood transfusions or in donating blood toward the carrying out of this medical practice upon others, he shows that he has really not repented, but is deliberately opposed to God’s requirements. As a rebellious opposer and unfaithful example to fellow members of the Christian congregation he must be cut off therefrom by disfellowshiping.

Post-Bulgaria blood policy:
(From the 2010 elder's manual):
Willingly and unrepentantly taking blood.
If someone willingly takes blood, perhaps because
of being under extreme pressure, the committee
should obtain the facts and detennine
the indjvidual's attitude. If he is repentant, the
committee would provide spiritual assistance in
the spirit of Galatians 6: 1 and Jude 22, 23. Since
he is spiritually weak, he would not qualify for
special privileges for a period of time, and it may
be necessary to remove certain basic privileges.
Depending on the circumstances, the committee
nlay also need to arrange for an announcement
to the congregation: "'The elders have
handled a matter having to do with [name
of person]. You will be glad to know that
spiritual shepherds are endeavoring to render
assistance." On the other hand, if the elders
on the committee determine that he is
unrepentant, they should announce his disassociation.

It's just a shell game by the wtbts. They will lie and even rewrite their policies to suit their own needs. Cult.

Band on the Run

How does one estabish repentance in real life? Are you supposed to go to Jerusalem and sit in sack cloth and ashes? It seems so discretionary on three jerks.

BluesBrother

The 2010 "Shepherding The Flock Book" under "Actions that indicate Disassociatian" lists "Willingly and unrepentantIy taking blood."

Until I see in print from the WTS that this has changed, I must accept that this is still the case. The WTS are the masters of weasel words and half truths when it suits them.

Repentance? When a sister flutters her eyes and looks upset and proclaims that she is sorry.....After all, the elders are only mortal men

Dogpatch

So far I have not been able to establish that anyone has been DF'd or DA'd in the last two years for taking a blood transfusion (without extenuating reasons, like vocal rebellion openly to their policy, or other "sins."

Zen called the Service Dept and they said they do not DF or DA for taking blood transfusions, although very hesitant to admit it. A few weeks later, the GB came out with the BOE on not allowing such questions to the Service Dept. A big Hmmmm....

The legal team is now running the WT, not the GB. If you understand how PR obfuscation works, just stay tuned and you will find out for yourself. The GB will rant and rave to the R&file about how it is still against God's law, and you must repent, but I suspect the legal team has advised them not to do that again. Most cases are intentionally covered over by the WT Society on purpose.

Forget for a moment that the WT is a religion. Imagine they are Enron. How honest do you expect them to be? The WT won't accept your calls anymore after the laterst BOE letter. Used to, it was easy to reach anyone in Bethel, just ask to talk to Gene Smalley's desk. :-))

If anyone has any proof that they have DF'ed or DA'd anyone in the last year or so for taking blood, discounting a case involving other WT sins, we would love to hear it and offer an apology. We have asked this of JWN members several times, and with no true example.

Watch out for those who just quote "watchtowerspeak." Kind of like "Enronspeak." This is a corporation that needs to heavily control their PR... which was ther basis of the ridiculous "Da'ing yourself" in the first place. The only reason they invented that doctrine was at the urging of the legal dept.

Randy

4. Randall's conversation with Gene Smalley (3/29/07)

http://www.freeminds.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=241:gene-smalley-and-the-watchtowers-blood-transfusion-doctrine&catid=19:medicine&Itemid=706

WT: Good afternoon, [we're] Jehovah's Witnesses.

Randy: Yes, I'd like to know if you could connect me with Gene Smalley's desk?

WT: Thank you, one moment please.

Smalley: Hello?

Randy: Hi, is this Gene?

Smalley: It is.

Randy: Hi Gene, my name is Randy Watters, and I'd like to know: Is it true that you've had a lot of influence in the Watchtower's blood doctrine?

Smalley: (slight pause) And, why are you asking?

Randy: Well, I've had some neighbors that are having a struggle with the blood issue, and they don't seem to be able to figure out if they can take certain fractions of blood or not, and someone indicated that you'd be helpful in that area. I'd like to know what publications in particular spell out the details on what fractions are allowed and what aren't?

Smalley: And, did you serve here at Bethel at one time?

Randy: Uh, yes.

Smalley: Well then I think you know what publications.

Randy: Well I haven't been reading the magazines lately so I'd be interested in knowing.

Smalley: The congregation can be of help. Bye now.

stuckinamovement

Randy are you referring to the legal procedures letter?

SIAM