What Are Some Of The Critical Items (Clues, Free Thinking) Ray Frantz Left Behind In Articles?

by Bubblegum Apotheosis 33 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Fernando
    Fernando

    Hey Randy!

    Thank you for that priceless insider info on the "secret Bible studies on Monday nights".

    I pray for support for your movie to preserve a very important part of history.

    The Watchtower is not entirely as insignificant as some would believe. They have created a mountain of legal precedents in favour of religion, all BASED ON LIES.

    The entire legal world has no idea how badly they were hoodwinked by Hayden C Covington's swindle purporting to "defend and legally establish the good news" whilst the WBTS has always been more ignorant of what the "good news" is than most.

    The social destruction wrought by pushing the divisive supremacist religious ideologies of legalism, moralism, ethnocentrism and Gnosticism instead of the "gospel of grace" are right there in our face, we simply have to SEE it. Literally trillions of dollars, and thanks in no small part to the Watchtower's breathtaking swindling and abuse of the legal system.

  • Dogpatch
    Dogpatch

    Wow, Fernando,

    Thank you.

    What have you researched? I apologize for not reading your posts yet.

    Randy

    I'll be back in a few hours. If I can even sleep now... I'm so pissed my best part got deleted somehow.

    As for the movie, all I can say is that everything I try to do on my own power fails.

    I don't expect anyone will fund it. So I'm not going to advertise it.

    My life has always been:

    your ambitious plans fail

    so I hold onto a log in the swift stream of life, and take what miraculously floats by me...

    and rejoice in the surprising nature of the miracle that follows, as if someone is watching over me.

    That keeps me humble in reality, though you wouldn't perceive it from my writings.

    I know many think I am a braggart or have some big ego.

    But I was born practically autistic. The 60s generation saved me from loss of all identity.

    No, I just have a story, and it's real, and I have to tell it before I die, alone and forgotten .

    It seems like all my peers are no longer able to perform. I'm near 60 myself.

    I end up being a loner, but with a driven energy.

    The time will come someday when I can no longer perform. I will do my best while I still have time.. I suffer much pain. I never get sick, but my body is wracked with pain continually.

    Few beleive my health issues, as it doesn't show on the outside. I have given up all but helping my friends.

    But no one will take advantage of me for long. I'm a tough old okie.

    Randy

  • Fernando
    Fernando

    Hey Randy!

    As you say those who would pursue social justice are indeed in need of seemingly "impossible" miracles as society is such a mix of amazing potential versus self-destruct, as we balance on the edge of the precipice. I am hopeful but also battle endless setbacks. My prayers and best wishes are with you.

    Researching, understanding and defining the "gospel of grace" versus its exact opposite "religion" has taken much of my time over the last 6 years.

    In the Watchtower ALL religion was a snare and a racket up to the early 1950's when Hayden C Covington's "ingenious" legal mind devised a way for the Watchtower to grab a share of religious privelege and save face at the same time too. The concepts of "true religion" and "false religion" were invented and the "gospel of grace" buried even further under religious legalism and moralism.

    The centrepiece of his swindle was the legal booklet released in 1950.

    *** w51 8/15 p. 511 Questions From Readers ***
    Why has the Watchtower Society suddenly approved the use of the word “religion” relative to the worship of Jehovah’s witnesses?—P. L., New York.

    *** w50 10/15 p. 393 par. 13 Further Enrichment of Understanding ***
    At the 1950 international assembly of Jehovah’s witnesses at Yankee Stadium, New York city, there was released to us the invaluable legal document , the 96-page booklet entitled “Defending and Legally Establishing the Good News”. (sic - actually "Defending and Legally Establishing the Watchtower religion").

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niemotko_v._Maryland

  • Fernando
    Fernando

    Hey Bubblegum Apotheosis!

    Below are two of my favourite clues hidden in plain sight by Ray Franz or others like him in 1979/80 relating to "legalism" (the making and keeping of endless rules in a vain effort to be right with God):


    *** g79 6/8 p. 28 Why the Emphasis on Christian Freedom? ***
    ...legalism... constitutes a denial of Christian faith.


    *** w80 5/1 p. 6 Learning from an Experiment That Failed ***

    “A Fence” to Prevent Wrongdoing

    Determination to avoid transgressing God’s law, even in minute details , caused the Pharisees to go yet farther. Jewish historian Flavius Josephus writes: “The Pharisees had passed on to the people certain regulations handed down by former generations and not recorded in the Laws of Moses .” Those regulations included a vast number of precepts for proper observance of the Sabbath. Concerning such non-Biblical “regulations,” the Jewish code of traditional laws known as The Mishnah states: “The rules about the Sabbath, Festal-offerings, and Sacrilege are as mountains hanging by a hair , for [teaching of] Scripture [thereon] is scanty and the rules many.”

    What was the purpose of so many rules of conduct? Some insight on this matter can be gained from a statement uttered by Jewish religious leaders before the Common Era: “Be deliberate in judgement, raise up many disciples, and make a fence around the Law.” The “fence” means traditions that supposedly would restrain persons from transgressing the written law of God. According to theory, if a person did not cross the fence, he would never be guilty of violating an actual Biblical decree.

    Did that experiment succeed? Did the massive body of oral traditions make better people out of the Israelites and the Pharisees in particular?

    Seeking God’s Favor Through Deeds

    Excessive attention to minute regulations had a harmful effect. It led to the belief that becoming righteous in God’s eyes was merely a matter of carrying out prescribed religious and charitable deeds. Each good deed was believed to earn “merit” with God, whereas every bad act would incur “debt.” Supposedly, God would one day make a tally of the record of merits and debts to determine whether a person was righteous or wicked.

    *** w80 5/1 pp. 6-7 Learning from an Experiment That Failed ***

    The teaching about earning merit and favor with God by good deeds caused many Pharisees to become self-righteous and condemnatory of others . A parable of Jesus with reference to “some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous and who considered the rest as nothing” states: “Two men went up into the temple to pray, the one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. The Pharisee stood and began to pray these things to himself, ‘O God, I thank you I am not as the rest of men, extortioners, unrighteous, adulterers, or even as this tax collector. I fast twice a week, I give the tenth of all things I acquire.’ ”

    *** w80 5/1 p. 8 Learning from an Experiment That Failed ***

    Historical facts are plentiful to show that the Pharisees’ experiment to promote righteousness by their way of observing religious precepts and performing charitable deeds was a failure . It neither influenced the majority toward godliness nor helped the Pharisees themselves to become better people. Instead, it influenced them to commit the worst crime in all history, the murder of the Son of God.

    However, the experiment was not altogether without usefulness. It set the stage for Jesus before his death to give the powerful message concerning human sinfulness and the need to seek salvation, not through works but as a free gift on the basis of repentance and faith in the sin-atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

  • tornapart
    tornapart

    Great thread!

  • james_woods
    james_woods

    Randy, as for Ed Dunlap (I knew him through his brother Marion in Oklahoma City - I resigned as elder and was DFd at the same time he was):

    1) - I do not think he ever created or published any religious book, tract, or other literature. At least I never saw anything - he was absolutely horribied by the idea that some might try to form a splinter group around him and always denounced that. He was all about a personal Christian relationship through self-study. There were rumors on and off that he had "started his own cult" and that was flatly a lie, and he was contemptuous of them.

    2) - I may stir up some contraversy by this: However, I really think that Ed was coming around to the idea of the trinity by the time he suddenly died. I think he was more and more of a traditional christian viewpoint at the end of his life. He definately had formed the opinion that the Christ figure was equally divine with the Jehovah figure. I think he privately felt the same way about the Holy Spirit, but he did not say this to others. Probably for fear that we would be repelled by the trinitarian concept it indicated. Marion also felt this way in his later years. For sure, one of Ed's greatest arguments against the WTBTS was that they minimized Christ by their obsession with GB/Jehovah references.

    3) - I do not know if he had differences with Ray Franz over this, but I do know that he gave me an advance copy of Crisis of Conscience when it was first published, but I never heard either Ed or Marion mention the second Christian Freedom book and I was in contact with both of them (as well as Betty Dunlap) until they were both dead.

  • Dogpatch
    Dogpatch

    Wow, James, that'a really enlightening. This also happened to Tom and Gloria Cabeen and the Sanchez, who are now Catholics. They consider the Catholics (in spite of their legal issues and bad mistakes, to more closely represent the original faith that Protestants, who basically re0interpreted the Bible any old way they wanted.) One instance is transubstantiation. The early Christians literally believed that the bread and wine became the body and blood of Christ miraculously in ceremony. The original texts are quite plain in this, as is the testimony of the earliest church fathers. It's all plain if you are not too lazy to just look it up.

    Even Peter Gregerson became a Trinitarian and part of a Protestant church. Good for him for being honest.

    The bottom line is, the Bible as understood by a disinterested scholar is treated like any other ancient book. The same rules of interpretation, beliefs at the time, and yellow journalism of the various schisms must be taken into account. But when you have a preconceived agenda like the WT and many Protestant churches, they won't tell you the real truth. Believe me, I have met many ignorant pastors out there. They spend years in seminary, and many finally learn the real truth, but they are so entrenched and obligated they keep their real awareness from the flock. Pretty dishonest. Theologians, on the other hand, and are NOT so threatened in losing money if they tell the truth.

    Ray's second book is more like Bible Students theology, preaching his own religion. No doubt Dunlap took issue with it. The very idea of a rotating governing body, or a governing body at all, is completely bogus. "In Search" is RAY's religion. But it is valuable for the insight into more of the organizational stuff.

    It's like he reverted back to the Bible Students.

    I have no problem with that, except that it's simply very poor scholarship. I really don't care what religion people belong to, as long as they know what they are talking about and are honest. It's all sky-daddies and super-daddies and devils to me.

    Ray was just a human being like the rest of us, but he IS a hero for doing what he did.

    Randy

  • Sic Semper Tyrannis
    Sic Semper Tyrannis

    Everyone certainly has differences of opinion and their right to them. I think you might have hit it right on the head when you say that Ray had some of the old GB still in him. In his books, and especially in COC, he was quite careful not to step on some toes even though he had nothing to lose. Not a word about the Chitty resignation for being gay. Nothing about Greenlees either in his second book, though it would have made it quite a selling point. Knorr, Swingle, Sydlik, Barry and a few others are portrayed as benign men who were captives to a concept, but he had a few scores to settle with Fred Franz, Klein, Henschel, Jaracz, and Schroeder. You get the distinct sense that from Ray's point of view, the Witnesses could have been reformed from within had the reform wing of the GB of which he were a member had prevailed. I doubt any meaningful reform could have taken place even if this were so. 1914 was a house a cards, and to truly reform the movement you'd have to scrap the entire history and start over. You can't build a religious movement on a lie. It must be admitted as such, with all corresponding and relating claims also dumped. It is interesting though, that the GB pleaded with Dunlap to be quiet and stay, while they seemed to have already wanted Ray out even before the final meeting. Maybe they viewed Ray as more of a threat, given his GB membership, and were uncomfortable with the associates he was keeping down in Alabama. To have been a fly on the wall during those discussions!

  • Dogpatch
    Dogpatch

    Sic Semper, interesting!

    Dunlap was not a threat to the GB's power, as he had no desire to be on the GB at all.

    Ray was a threat to the entire GB, because it would render them virtually powerless to bully people with a rotating GB. .

    You have to understand that NONE of those newly-chosen GB members were innocent of power hunger, except perhaps Greenlees and Chitty! and maybe one or two others who had been at Bethel already for years. All the rest were just ITCHING for the power they struggled to move up to for years... Henschel even voicing that they had no power a few months later in a closed Bethel elder's meeting. I would have loved to tape record it, but I had no idea in advance what they were going to talk about.

    They were dying for control. Especially Schroeder, Suiter, and especially Klein. Klein was a power freak, and a real tool. Tom Cabeen told me that he had a copy of Mein Kampf on his bookshelf in his office. Fit him well.

    Tom told me the story one day about when he walked into Sydlik's office, and the door was half open (they were good buddies, Sydlik wasn't too bad, and could laugh and have fun and liked to just be one of the brothers), but Tom was hidden from view behind the half-open door, so only Sydlik was visible unless you walked fully into his office.

    Klein came BUSTING in Sydlik's office, not noticing Tom, and said, "IVE FINALLY MADE IT! I'M NOW ON THE GOVERNING BODY!"

    Then as he walked further in, he noticed Cabeen sitting next to Sydlik. He turned very red in the face.

    Shows you what these old guys were really all about. They had brown-nosed their asses off for years to get on the GB. The exception was Jaracz, who was called from the Australian branch by Knorr for the sole purpose of putting the new GB in their place and taking over the SS Service Dept., which I believe was really a ploy to eventually destroy the organization since he was dying and could no longer run it. It might have also been a ploy to get Jaracz out of Australia, as there had been rumors of his sexual misconduct with a couple of sisters.(Do I smell Catholic Church?)

    Listen to Freddy's speech again at the 1975 Gilead Graduation. It will be up on Freeminds in about an hour or two, right out of the assembly hall. I think Knorr actually WAS there now that I listen to it, as he appeared briefly to say a few words, but he was pretty sick with cancer and stumbled around.

    A good church will always have checks and balances, with a board that is capable of firing the pastor if need be. But it often is not set up that way, and the Pastor can easily become a cult leader. That's how Jim Jones and David Koresh went out of control.

    Bethel was no different.

    Randy

  • Dogpatch
    Dogpatch

    Swingle was onee of the worst in the very end. He was close to Ray and followed his thinking up until Ray was called on the carpet, in total sympathy! But the GB became suspicious of Swingle for that, and literally FORCED Swingle to take a vocal stand against Ray. I think Lyman was so angry at being manipulated he just decided to be one of the worst of all in the end, deriding Ray and downright very nasty about it. But somehow, you could read between the lines and tell he was angry at the GB for forcing him into this position.

    Happens in cults all the time, according to several former high-position leaders. They are forced into criminalizing their own colleagues with extreme threats. Just like splitting up families in the WT... never allow more loyalty to your family than the organization.

    Didn't Stalin do that? Kill a ton of his own commanders?

    Randy

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit