Can you please give us the quote from Dawkins with context please?
Here is the context Cofty. Dawkins spoke at the Reason Rally in Washington DC this year. No apologies.
Peter Singer Atheist Champion "A Pig Is Worth More Than A Disabled Person!'"
by Bubblegum Apotheosis 26 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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NewChapter
Here is a better quality video, but much longer. You can scroll forward to Dawkins.
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PaintedToeNail
At the library, there was a book on Hitler's regime. It had a photo of a beautiful, dark haired deaf boy of about 4 years of age, sitting on a 'nurse's' knee, the 'kindly' 'doctor' was holding a syringe. The 'nurse' and 'doctor' were getting ready to kill him because he was born deaf.
After seeing that photo, and the mere recollection of it now, made and makes me nauseated. It sends chills up my spine.
At what point is a disabled person considered to be worth less than an animal? Deafness? Blindness? Missing arms? I would hate to be forced to make that decision. If the person cannot communicate, does this mean they don't enjoy seeing flowers, smelling pizza, eating? If a person who is themselves ill and in pain makes a decision to end their own life, that is one thing...but to make the decision for someone else is another thing entirely.
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MrFreeze
Do some research on Godwin's law. You fulfilled it almost immediately. I'm interested to know where Peter Singer said anything about killing all the disabled people or "Putting them out of their misery".
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GeneM
He's a troll who (like many) fights what he could not posibly understand. So... You know the nazi thing will come up immediately.
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JWdaughter
This has some serious implications and it does make a person think. We do value human life, and the reason is that we contribute to each other, we enrich each other, we have added value. So, when a person is only a taker(not in the usual sense of the word, just in the sense that he cannot ever contribute), I can see why a person might think the way Singer does. I actually find it hard to argue with him-except, I know that there are a lot f people who, while not cognizant in a way that seems significant to Singer or someone else, DOES have life, has a mind and has things to offer-even if they aren't economically on a par with someone else. I have a severely disabled nephew-vegetative as far as we can tell. He doesn't respond to anything but pain. But we don't really know what goes on in his mind. I have known a LOT of DS people and they vary from mildly disabled (they marry and have simple jobs) to profoundly disabled. Who wants to draw a line (other than the amnio parents who draw it before they know how disabled the child is). Who wants to tell my dear friend with spina bifida that his life has no value? He is nearly 50, lived a productive life for many years until liver cancer got him(unrelated to SB). He is in hospice now. He spent his life disabled, but he worked for SS and had increasingly responsible positions. Sb affected his body, not his mind at all.
I do think it is nuts sometimes providing some services for people who get no benefit or value. I don't know how to reconcile that with decency to all of humanity when one child who can't even ENJOY it has millions spent in his support over a few years time before death-by the state.
My b/SIL have 3 kids. Their whole life is focused around the one that can't do anything, can't respond, etc. etc. They are getting in home nursing, private tutors and all kinds of social welfare assistance that costs enornous amounts of money, not to mention the frequent hospitalizations, surgeries, etc. I understand society supporting those who need it, but this is limousine care for a person who could be put in a basket and wouldn't care. He isn't learning anything, he will never contribute to society or even give his devoted mom a loving look. The value in his life is in that he is (maybe) developing the compassion of those who care for him. He might though be creating angry resentful siblings who have missed a lot of things because their oldest brother can't go there, do it, or participate.
Do I think he should have been destroyed? No. I don't think we should kill human beings. I do think that there should be some rationality about how social services are distributed and what is considered necessary. He has literally had millions spent in his care and he is 12 now. How much food would that buy for many homeless or jobless people? How many textbooks or immunizations are not being provided? Basic and humane care can be given without providing an "education" for this child who will never grasp the letter "A", much less the "Scarlett Letter". The make a wish foundation has now provided two trips to disneyland for the family. And for the other kids, I think that is a great support-THEY need a vacation-but they have to take the oldest, drag him through an amusement park and someone waits with him while the others go and play. Well meaning, but ridiculous. He doesn't respond to any stimulus but pain. I think that is so sad, and I love the little guy because he is family. I am so devastated at how much pain and suffering this causes his parents. My brother is in a severe depression and has been for years. I used to have hope for this child, but the miracles he needs are beyond science and not seen in nature in these modern times.
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THE GLADIATOR
Nature is cruel to be kind. A beautiful flower is not beautiful to nature unless it has the strength to survive. Even the rose has thorns. It is estimated that 96% of every species that has lived on earth is extinct. Survival is a precarious task and one which most living things fail to achieve. If a creature is not equipped to survive, that species will ultimately become extinct. Of course I am forgetting that all things were created by a loving god that is taking care of everything, including the 96% that died-out on his day off!
If humans have a duty, then it is to survive and help other less fortunate people to also survive. This involves making us stronger and more resilient to disease, and physical weakness. Problem is, we are doing a better job than god and the planet is not big enough to cope with our population explosion. If we don’t reduce our population growth and take better care of the planet, nature will act on our behalf. It has already demonstrated how ruthless it can be.
Disclaimer: These forward-looking statements are not guarantees of the future performance of humans or the natural world nature. As my opinion only, they are subject to risks, uncertainties and other factors, some of which are beyond my control and are difficult to predict. Consequently, actual results could differ materially from those expressed, implied or forecasted in these forward-looking statements.