That was awesome. I may steal that one day for personal use. Thanks.
Surprise Elder's Visit-FAIL
by iclone 59 Replies latest jw friends
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Witness My Fury
Yep, I'm nickin' that one too. Good stuff.
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puffthedragon
That is a great argument. I have never thought about that one and I LOVE using the bible against JW's. Im filing this one away. Well done good and faithful slave!
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King Solomon
Wouldn't you just LOVE to be a fly on the wall and hear what they said to each other on the long car ride home?
Do you think they talked about what they're going to have to do (converge the body), discuss scriptural tactical mistakes they made, or (gasp!) dared to discuss the challenges to their faith you brought up?
I'm going with the first option (what fun is being an Elder if you don't get to convene the body and DF someone?)...
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Glander
It's simple. They simply force an answer to the litmus question I mentioned above.
How do I know? Because that is what my several meetings with fellow elders boiled down too.
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elderelite
Pure genuis
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Lozhasleft
Absolutely spot on. Well done!
Loz x
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Sulla
Very well done. By the way, you just got disfellowshipped.
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Bobcat
"if they come back with a basic "Do you believe the WTS is Jehovah's organization?" and your answer will have to be yes or no."
If I could make a suggestion. (rule number one) If "they come back" with the above question, DO NOT answer "yes" or "no." The tendency will be to answer the way they want you to. But, DO NOT! It is a loaded question. They will only be looking for you to condemn yourself so that they can be thru with you. DO NOT let an appealing manner or a warm smile or a handshake or anything else, melt your resolve. (Also, always be cordial yourself.)
Throw the question back on them: "You tell me" or "I'll let you answer that." Or use that but throw in a little extra: "I'll let you give me your opinion." (This throws a doubtful - 'you have yours, I have mine' - tone to the discussion. BUT never give them yours!) The elders respond: 'Now, we want you opinion.' You respond: "My opinion isn't important. Shouldn't you ask Jehovah that?" Another possibility is: "Ah, that's something to think about." (This last one is right out of the Pioneer Service Book. It's meant for giving a response when you really don't want to say what you really think.)
Or if they insist on a yes or no answer, give them exactly that: "Yes or no." 'No, we want one or the other.' "Ok, one or the other." And each time make them re-ask the entire question again. And if they don't ask it exactly the same way as before, point that out. Make them repeat it exactly. Make the other brother (the one that is not asking the question) definitely state whether he agrees that he is also the asker of this question. What you are doing is tiring them out and turning the interrogators into the interrogated.
Alternatively, make them put the question on paper and sign it, so that you can look at it for a while. After all, they will use their two selves as witnesses against you. So make them become witnesses against themselves in regard to the question they want you to answer. Of course, it is doubtful they will agree to do this. They've been trained by the Society to not incriminate or leave any physical evidence about themselves. But if they won't put their question in writing, don't give your answer. They want you to put yourself on the line by answering. Make them put themselves on the line by going on record as having been the ones who asked the question. (And if by chance they do put it in writing, take it and say you'll need several days to think about it. And when they come back - go to rule number one.)
Also (rule number two), NEVER REPEAT YOURSELF. If you have already given an answer (whatever it may be), never give it again. If they want you to repeat yourself, make them tell you what you have already said. And if they don't state it like you said, point out emphatically that that is not what you said. The purpose of there being two of them is to be witnesses of what you said. So if they want you to repeat yourself, use their witnesses to your advantage. (REMEMBER, even if you say "Yes" a hundred times, and "NO" only once, they will take the "No" and use it against you. - So never repeat yourself!)
Also (rule number three), Do not let them put words in your mouth. They might use a phrase such as, "Oh, so your saying ...". What they are doing is interpreting what you did say, and if you agree with "so your saying ...", then, it is the same as if you said it. And they have the two witnesses to confirm it. So don't be trapped by that. "Oh, so your saying ...", "No, brother, there is no double meaning in my words." Or, "What I said is what I was saying. Nothing more.")
Also (rule number four), and this depends on your physical circumstances: DO NOT let them surround you, physically that is. DO NOT let them position you with your back to the wall. Keep moving, subtley, so that they are positioned with their backs to the wall. If there are two or three, keep moving to the right or left so that only one is directly in front of you. It is a mental thing. It gives the impression that you are in control. That you are outflanking them.
Take Care
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Quendi
I agree with Sulla about the quality of your argument and its probable outcome. However, you are too good for this crowd and even if they don't disfellowship you, you've just made your fade a lot smoother.
Quendi