Even after reading Crisis of Conscience, one thing (at least) still puzzled me

by kepler 29 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  kepler

  It was several years back and from time to time I will look something up in the index. All manner of things about JW life are revealed - as well as discussions within the leadership, plus historical and contemporary controversies - but there is still something I missed.

  Please excuse me if this is not a detailed summary.

  When the drum roll starts for the purge, it appears that the friends and associates of Ray Franz are targeted first. There are inquiries about who said what, or have you heard this from a friend or from other people in the department - and then the ax falls all over the place. Ray was one of the last to go - and he goes down for associating with someone who is disfellowshipped for associating with him. Is that close enough?

  Now in the course of writing the book, all manner of background issues are examined - but Ray Franz was dismissed before writing the book. The book is an account with a number of updates and revisions, all I presume, written after the fact. Interspersed in the narrative are accounts of things like the difficulty of constructing a case for 607 BC, meeting with Olaf Johnsson, votes sometimes in minority on doctrinal issues - but I don't recall seeing anywhere where the author says "that's why the majority came after me".

  Now after being on this forum for a while, I have begun to realize that some participants have actually witnessed all this first hand - pardon the expression. And I myself am quite far removed from that. But I do see parallels in dissidence movements elsewhere. I am tempted to ramble on about that, but I fear that I am obscuring the focus on the matter at hand.

  Any comments?
• 

  EntirelyPossible

  More of a question. What are you trying to say?
• 

  Phizzy

  Could you frame your question in plain language please ? are you asking why the axe fell on Ray later than others ? If so, it is my opinion that the GB did not know quite how to handle him in the way that would do least damage to the WT.

  They seem not to have wanted to DF a GB member for Apostasy, this would have caused no end of speculationas to what Ray believed, and worse would remove the Aura of Infallibility and a Hot-line to Heaven Authority that the GB was trying to build up.

  To DF mere Bethelites from H.Q that were close to Ray was no problem. To let Ray resign, leave Bethel, go in to obscurity (also known as Bumblefuck) and then DF him on some minor matter was their plan. They DF'd him on doubtful grounds/timing as it was, his dining with Gregorson having occurred before they had spelled such out as a DFing offense.

  Typical inept GB cock-up tainted by spitefull hatred and self interest.
• 

  jgnat

  Why did they come so fast and hard after Ray Franz? Because he dared to resign based on his conscience. If he had a conscience, what did that say about the rest of them?

  I think you are also asking if anyone on the board was closer to events. I don't think so. This happened a long time ago.
• 

  OnTheWayOut

  it appears that the friends and associates of Ray Franz are targeted first.

  That can be a strategy. If they were going to kick out a Governing Body member, they wanted to interview and judge others involved first. They probably thought that would look more impartial than just starting at Ray. They seemed to think he had a following. If they started with Ray, they probably thought the others would not talk, but simply clam up or leave and follow Ray. Remember that DA and DF were not as clearly defined then as to the shunning rules.

  but Ray Franz was dismissed before writing the book. The book is an account with a number of updates and revisions, all I presume, written after the fact.

  All accounts would be "after the fact." I don't believe Ray would have even wrote a book like CoC if they did not disfellowship him. Still, from my reading, I can see that it was a factual account that seemed to offer a chance for any rebuttal writing. It isn't surprising, though, that there is no rebuttal story in print from anyone at WTS.
• 

  Knowsnothing

  but I don't recall seeing anywhere where the author says "that's why the majority came after me".

  I haven't read the book completely, and In Search of Cristian Freedom deals with other aspects the first book doesn't explain. My question is, did Franz speak to the GB about his position on 607 along with other doctrines/policies he disagreed with?

  Another thing is to note is that his associates were targeted first, perhaps because they were more vocal about it or got caught. Now, given that situation, the Purge in Bethel, why would Franz need to spell out "that's why the majority came after me"?
• 

  Theocratic Sedition

  Maybe going after the friends and associates of Ray Franz was similar to a District Attorney putting the screws on a petty dope dealer or low ranked member of a criminal organization, hoping he'll flip and give up the goods on who's supplying him or higher ups in their criminal activity. So all the while the investigative committee in Bethel was going after various individuals and couples, they had the ulterior motive of building a substantial case on Ray Franz. They may have intended to bring it to the table with Ray Franz present amongst the rest of the GB during one of their meetings. They do that within elder bodies now if there's something questionable about an elder on the body or someone in his family. The entire elder body will be present while the accusing brother(s) lays whatever claim towards the elder in question, and then the body as a whole discusses it. Ray didn't give them the oppurtunity to pull a stunt like that which probably pissed them off in a severe way.
• 

  kepler

  Entirely Possible,

  I hope some of the posts by others between this one and yours made my question a little more plain. As some have recounted, Ray Franz was DFed on - for lack of better term - a technicality. For associating with someone who had been disciplined for associating with him. It's an Orwellian trip all right, but it never really exposes the reasons why the GB majority went after him.

  When I read CoC and is sequel, I read a writer whose convictions are still very close to the world within which he grew up and labored with devotion all his life. Much of what he was saying seems like a call for reform. But I can't get the full picture. It was pointed out above that Ray Franz resigned as a matter of conscience, And as the book describes, Ray Franz was in the minority on a number of votes on issues. Now had he have been more persuasive and won those votes, then would he have stayed? Would there have been an alternate history for WTBTS like that we would suppose for Soviet Russia under Trotskij or Bukharin? Or was it already clear to Ray Franz that the system could not be reformed? Since Ray Franz's arguments are very scripturally based, he has raised some big unanswered questions.
• 

  slimboyfat

  Not sure what you mean. But if you are alluding to the fact that Ray Franz wash pushed out against his will rather than leaving over a 'crisis of conscience', as the title might be taken to suggest, then this has been noted previously.
• 

  james_woods

  Now after being on this forum for a while, I have begun to realize that some participants have actually witnessed all this first hand - pardon the expression. And I myself am quite far removed from that. But I do see parallels in dissidence movements elsewhere. I am tempted to ramble on about that, but I fear that I am obscuring the focus on the matter at hand.

  Any comments?

  I can tell you what the Dunlap brothers thought. Both of them believed that the GB controlling majority wanted Ray to step down from the Governing Body quietly and allow them to put him out to pasture as a special pioneer in some out-of-theway location. Much like they did with sex offenders Geenlees and Chtty. They feared what would happen if his dissention became public.

  He did leave Bethel in a fairly quiet manner - moved back home, but was later DFd under trumped up charges for associating with a DFd person.

  I think he was disfellowshipped before CoC was published.

  Ed Dunlap was given the offer that he could stay at Bethel in relative comfort if he would just quietly renounce his questions about Watchtower doctrines - but, of course, he simply told them to buzz off.

  I haven't read Crises of Conscience in many years, but I thought that Ray explained this