Believe it or not, another brief elder encounter yesterday...

by sd-7 29 Replies latest jw friends

  • sd-7
    sd-7

    It was another elder from my judicial committee, came up to me after I'd strapped my daughter into the car. Two things that struck me as different were (1) he didn't feel a need to bring a second elder along with him as if something that required two witnesses was going to be said by someone who'd been DF'd for two years and 99.9% absent from meetings as well, and (2) he actually seemed genuinely friendly. He simply asked if I was planning to come to the meetings again anytime soon. I told him, honestly, no.

    But you know, it always does something to me emotionally when they seem warm and friendly. It reminds me that these aren't people who in themselves are evil or 'the bad guys'. They're just as much an unwitting part of the big con as I once was. It makes it hard to say no to someone like that--and I guess being a born-in I generally find it hard to say no to people even when I'm getting screwed royally. It reminds me of the fact that I do have a family in this, and I am missing the big piece of my marriage by not being there with them. Overseeing their training more directly could in theory open opportunities to be more able to guide them away from all this. In theory. But considering my wife's level of paranoia, it's unlikely I could accomplish anything other than getting ratted out again. And generating unnecessary stress. So it's not like I would ever seriously consider going back again, no matter how nice any one individual is. When I see how 'nice' this religion helped my wife to be, it shows me I have nothing to gain from them.

    Of course, the thought that immediately came to mind after I'd gotten in my car and gotten off the parking lot was...this is how abusers work. They want to keep you off-balance emotionally. Highs and lows short-circuit rational thinking. It's quite possible this elder was one who might even have wanted to give me a second chance during the committee but the chairman shouted 'em all down. Even so, whether he's the genuine article in terms of what a JW elder can/should be, it doesn't matter. What's printed in the literature each month is a fresh reminder for me that there is simply no redemption for an organization this thoroughly self-deluded. There's no hope it will become kinder and gentler, as it exists only to feed and serve itself and squeeze whatever it can get out of its members.

    I think it's far less upsetting than the previous encounter, simply because that chairman seems almost like he's out to prove a point or something. He doesn't seem to approach me as an equal or as a man, more as a lord of sorts himself. There's just something about him that seems not quite right to me. It's a sort of arrogance that he seems to exude. I may be wrong, may be totally misreading it, but there's something I don't like there. It's like that one bad guy in the end battle who starts shoving everybody aside to get to you, if you know what I mean? I don't know.

    Didn't really need to vent about it this time, just thought it was worth mentioning since I started talking about myself again lately. I do wonder when the Mrs. is going to find out about sd-7. I suppose it'll probably nuke our marriage if she ever does. I've said some pretty bad things about her in the past, that I would rather have kept to myself in hindsight. Well, it could be for the best anyway if that were to happen, sad as it is to say that. I've often wondered if anyone I know actually knows I'm on here, but none so far have brought it to my attention. I imagine things would get pretty ugly if they knew. At this point, though, how much more ugly can there be? The bombs dropped years ago, the madness is over now. As long as I don't strike the match, the flames won't get too hot and might even die off on their own, who knows? Ha!

    Well, enough rambling. Until next time...

    --sd-7

  • Theocratic Sedition
    Theocratic Sedition
    It makes it hard to say no to someone like that--and I guess being a born-in I generally find it hard to say no to people even when I'm getting screwed royally.

    I wonder how many born-ins can relate to this, I know I can. The WT has even printed articles about saying no to privileges when one is already has far too much on their plate. It's like Frankenstein, they've created a monster in the form of born-ins inability to say no. Stabbed myself over with more pains from an inability to say no than from chasing after $$$.

  • undercover
    undercover

    It does something to you emotionally because you know, despite how geniunely friendly he seemed, he has an ulterior motive. "Are you going to become one of us again?" Even if not the very words used, it is the thought behind anything they say to you. It is a guilt trip. Nothing less.

    It could be that they're sincere, at least how they consider sincere... they see you in the parking lot, they wanna reach out. But - the conspiracy part of my brain says, "watch out". They're giving you a chance to 'repent', come back. If you show your disdain for the "truth", then don't be surprised if they start working on your wife. Wanting her to give more service to the organization, effectively cutting you out more. If she's reluctant, they could then warn her of an endangered spiritual state by staying married to an obvious opposer of Jehovah.

    I hope I ain't putting bad thoughts in your head, but you do have to be wary. You can NOT trust these people.

  • hoser
    hoser

    Of course, the thought that immediately came to mind after I'd gotten in my car and gotten off the parking lot was...this is how abusers work. They want to keep you off-balance emotionally. Highs and lows short-circuit rational thinking.

    you are exactly right my friend this is what is going on.

  • sd-7
    sd-7
    They're giving you a chance to 'repent', come back. If you show your disdain for the "truth", then don't be surprised if they start working on your wife. Wanting her to give more service to the organization, effectively cutting you out more. If she's reluctant, they could then warn her of an endangered spiritual state by staying married to an obvious opposer of Jehovah.

    Okay. Are you saying they will suggest (but perhaps not say outright) to my wife that she should separate or that she has grounds for separation? Such grounds would be shaky at best, I would think. It can't be argued that I'm utterly opposed if I'm giving her rides to and from meetings and sat through half the district convention for her.

    If I'm misinterpreting you, undercover, let me know. But following this line of thought through to its end, I just don't buy my wife going for that. There's too much on the line for her too--financially, for one, emotionally with the kids and basically putting her in the position of being a single mom with two small kids. I've not rattled the apostate saber enough in recent times to warrant her skipping town on me. As much as we've struggled in our marriage, it would be strange indeed for elders to apply the hatchet to it at this point.

    But they've proven their intent is blackmail in the past, so I am conscious that it could be applied in the future. The existence of sd-7, if discovered, would provide all the evidence they needed, though. Hmm. Interesting. Reminds me of that feeling I get when I'm playing chess and I think I'm maybe two moves away from losing. Not a good feeling. I'll keep my eyes open.

    --sd-7

  • perfect1
    perfect1

    the thought that immediately came to mind after I'd gotten in my car and gotten off the parking lot was...this is how abusers work. They want to keep you off-balance emotionally. Highs and lows short-circuit rational thinking.

    Yep. But good for you for recongnizing the pattern.

  • Knowsnothing
    Knowsnothing

    Didn't really need to vent about it this time, just thought it was worth mentioning since I started talking about myself again lately. I do wonder when the Mrs. is going to find out about sd-7. I suppose it'll probably nuke our marriage if she ever does. I've said some pretty bad things about her in the past, that I would rather have kept to myself in hindsight. Well, it could be for the best anyway if that were to happen, sad as it is to say that. I've often wondered if anyone I know actually knows I'm on here, but none so far have brought it to my attention. I imagine things would get pretty ugly if they knew. At this point, though, how much more ugly can there be? The bombs dropped years ago, the madness is over now. As long as I don't strike the match, the flames won't get too hot and might even die off on their own, who knows? Ha! - sd-7

    Good luck man. How would you feel without her? That is a serious question I have to contemplate myself about my family. It may be happening real soon....

  • elderelite
    elderelite

    First SD, glad to hear from my friend :-)

    I dont think they will go the endagerment route. It would be extremly difficult for them to call you a danger when you drive your wife and little one to and from the meetings. Dont lose sleep over that.

    But you are spot on about the maner of abusers being to tear down and offer a small carrot of warmth. Learn to insulate yourself emotionally and call it what it is: abuse.

  • 00DAD
    00DAD

    sd-7: this is how abusers work. They want to keep you off-balance emotionally. Highs and lows short-circuit rational thinking.

    Absolutely! I see others have commented on this and just want to confirm what they said.

    It's important that you recognize this and keep your distance from them and them at an appropriate distance from you.

    The problem is that they continually insinuate themselves into your life and since you're out and your wife is in they--intentionally or not--do things that divide you and your wife.

    I say intentionally or not in response to your OP comment about the one elder possibly being genuine and sincere. Nevertheless, WT/JW "theology", rules, policies, practices and culture are designed to separate families when one is "In the Truth" and the other has left.

    Abusers gotta' abuse.

    I don't know if you saw this thread on the subject of BOUNDARIES. You might find it helpful:

    Hang in there!

    00DAD

  • flipper
    flipper

    SD-7- What 00DAD, Hoser, and some of the others said, I agree. Be careful ! It's a con game to get you back in and under their control

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