Has this thought from the Jan awake page 7 always been?

therevealer

Her church teaches that God
never forgives suicide. But
I showed her how the Bible
gives a hope of a resurrection.
(John 5:28, 29)

sd-7

This is just a recruiting ploy--I wonder how hopeful she would feel if she read the WT articles about whether or not elders should handle funerals for JWs who commit suicide.

--sd-7

james_woods

If God never forgives suicide, then what about Samson?

wallsofjericho

brother - "she's very sad"

elder - "why?"

brother - "her husband committed suicide"

elder - (whispers) - "oh, really? oh boy"

wife - "My husband was such a good man. Jehovah MUST know that!"

elder to grieving wife: "only Jehovah reads hearts."

teary eyed wife - "oh thank you"

elder to other brother - (rolls eyes = no resurrection for him!)

other brother - (rolls eyes back = "tell me about it, snicker snicker")

sir82

The Society has been pretty much forced to soften its stance on suicide in recent years.

Old WTs from the 60's & earlier came down really hard on it, saying that in virtually every circumstance there would be no resuurection.

In recent decades, as the number of JW suicides has increased dramatically, such a hard-line position was quite difficult for survivors to accept.

So, it is now pretty much met with a "Jehovah will read the heart, and maybe resurrect if there was some mental or emotional imbalance".

james_woods

Interesting point, Sir82. I had not correlated the change in thinking on suicide to the increased incidence of JW suicides.

I do recall the 1960s pathos over who would be resurrected and who would not. There was almost a mini-teapot-storm over whether or not Adam & Eve would. I cannot recall what they finally decided on this - if I recall correctly they just said that it was up to Jehovah.

Once again - pontification on something about which the bible itself says very little.

ballistic

Do you remember that thing in the Watchtower about "unforgivable sins?" what was that all about?

DesirousOfChange

If God never forgives suicide, then what about Samson?

DING DING DING DING JAMES, YOU ARE OUR WINNER!!!!

But before you drop the Samson Question, and ask them general questions about a brother or sister or worldly family member who commits suicide. Wait for all the "OMG, suicide is SELF-MURDER!"

Then ZING 'em with Samson! All of a sudden, everthing that was so BLACK & WHITE sudddenly BLURs...............

A Speechless JW = PRICELESS

Doc

james_woods

The "unforgiveable sin" is one of the biggest JW doctrine mysteries there is.

Basically they have maneuvered themselves all over the map on this to say that it basically means ANY sin which you do not repent of.

An honest reading of the bible on this (and the bible itself is very mysterious on the subject) could hardly give you that impression.

"The Sin against the Holy Spirit" - wht could it possibly mean?

When I was a JW, speculating on this, and having to comment on it as an elder, I used to speculate that it might mean that a person denied the miracles of the early apostles - i.e. from Pentecost on...which would be denial of the "actions" of the Holy Spirit.

Actually, the whole NT notion of the "Holy Spirit" is in itself quite mysterious. I have been thinking for a couple of weeks about starting a thread on this subject.

outsmartthesystem

DOC - Sadly that could easily be refuted. A good jw would just say "yeah....but Jehovah TOLD him to". Remember....if the great Jah tells you to do something that violates His own laws (suicide is murder of oneself)....it is all ok!

Has this thought from the Jan awake page 7 always been?

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