Really, really weird. That's one messed up elder. It's almost as if they are bragging about their own accomplishments and almost " giddy " that this poor woman died so that they can show what " GOOD " Witnesses they are for all their organizational details regarding her funeral and for proselytizing to the police and " worldly " people about how " good " JW's are. Incredibly tacky and boorish behavior. As some other poster pointed out , what about the fact that this stalker was in their own kingdom hall planning this murder ? These people are absolutely insane
JW spin on the lady that got murderd my Holt
by greenhornet 17 Replies latest jw friends
-
-
steve2
Why is this reaction so hard to understand?
Who, oh who, said this reaction is so hard to understand?
On the basis of that kind of "rational" thinking, the more we understand, the more we should simply "let stuff go". In general, we do; but there are times such as this shocking rape and murder that we are hit - as if for the first time even though we damn well know it isn't - by the shocking realization of how even we would have reacted as JWs.
Call it, expressing emotion for its own expressive value.
Just as jumping up and down with joy can be cathartic, so can a well planned rant and rave. We're humans - not automatons. To feel and react at will and with energy keeps us alive, connected and hopefully not so nicely contained that we become dead inside.
I hope that answers your teacherly question.
-
fiddler
This is really not about Whitney or the letter but I just had to say, tonight is Halloween and it's been raining ALL WEEK but since 4:30 pm the rain stopped and it's been just a wonderful fall evening free of rain for the Halloween trick or treaters.
Must be divine intervention!
just saying...........
That letter was written by an idiot IMHO.
-
free @ last
Why is this reaction so hard to understand?
The question was entirely rhetorical. I think the JW reaction expressed in the email has much more to do with the predicament most believers find themselves in when bad things happen than anything having to do with the more cult like characteristics of JWs. When shit goes down a believer has to search high and low for something good to give god credit for. It's not just cult members who are guilty of this.
-
Purza
I manage to stay silent on a lot of propaganda my mother sends. However, if she sends me this email, I am afraid I cannot stay silent. This whole case has gotten under my skin and I read everything I can find to make sense of what happened (even though I know there are no answers).
Purza
-
Aussie Oz
bets on the bank official who waved the rules was a JW too....?
Oz
-
wha happened?
it's this stupid God connection that every JW feels they have. Like they get to be in the front of the line with prayers, as opposed to the other 99% of the population.
God didn't protect her but helped people find her body and prevented rain. Well 'dubs, I guess u got the boobie prize on that deal.
-
ziddina
OOOOOH brother...
First, let me say that this was a terrible tragedy. My subsequent comments are not meant to minimize the horrific nature of this crime, nor the heinous behavior of their fellow Jehovah's Witness in brutally assaulting and murdering this poor JW girl.
But reading that elder's letter, several things leapt out at me.
So many of the posters on this thread have pointed out how brainwashed and cognitive-dissonant some of his comments are, but as Flipper said,
"It's almost as if they are bragging about their own accomplishments and almost " giddy " that this poor woman died so that they can show what " GOOD " Witnesses they are for all their organizational details regarding her funeral and for proselytizing to the police and " worldly " people about how " good " JW's are. "
I also agree with his assessment of their behavior:
"Incredibly tacky and boorish behavior."
What really struck me, was the exaggeration of the 'effect' that the Jehovah's Witnesses' behavior supposedly 'had' upon the "worldly" people - who, in his story, have practically been relegated to a 'spectator' role - including the police, the sheriff's department, and so on...
Here are the particular phrases:
"...The authorities are amazed to see the parents there feeding all these people and comment how they have never seen a people so organized and so giving of themselves. ..."
"...On tonight’s TV news, one week later, they commented that this is the largest flower display of emotion in Portland’s entire history. ..."
"...The Chief of Police has said that it is obvious that “God is with you people”, and the stories of how the evidence was so quickly found by the Brothers and Sisters and all came together so quickly, there is little doubt as to who was helping! ..."
"...A floral shop calls and asks if they can donate flowers to the event. They fly in on special order thousands of dollars’ worth of floral arrangements from Hawaii and fill the Kingdom Hall. ..."
"... The friends were frantically working to prepare food for the Friday event, but we didn’t have a clue how much food we would need. There was now enough food for 1,400 people. But was that enough? The brother in charge offered a prayer to Jehovah with the group, and as they said “Amen” the telephone rang. It was the manager of Wal-Mart saying he wanted to donate 4,000 sandwiches. Then the telephone rang again and again – from Albertsons and Safeway also wanting to make donations of food. ..."
"...The clouds were dark and low, 80% chance of heavy rain predicted. A Brother said, “With all of Jehovah’s direction and support this week, he isn’t about to let it rain.” Sure enough, it didn’t rain that day! ..."
"...Starbucks employees came with three large boxes filled to the top with money they had collected to help the family with funeral expenses. ..."
"... So many were coming in, they simply couldn’t be counted. But we estimate that there were between 3,000 and 4,000 people that came. ..."
"...The chief of police said that the next time someone goes missing in Portland, he is going to call on Jehovah’s Witnesses. ..."
The above comments have a breathless, exaggerated and over-the-top quality that strongly remind me of medieval tales of the sufferings of the various saints - how they suffered, what excruciating pains they endured, how happy they remained in the face of their certain martyr's death, how many evil, "pagan" persecutors were moved to 'conversion' at the sight of the saint's meek, humble suffering, how the saint wished them all well - to gain a true knowledge of Christ, how the saint[s] forgave them their evil acts against him/her...
From: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/maps/primary/perpetua.html
A number of young catechumens were arrested, Revocatus and his fellow slave Felicitas, Saturninus and Secundulus, and with them Vibia Perpetua, a newly married woman of good family and upbringing. Her mother and father were still alive and one of her two brothers was a catechumen like herself. She was about twenty-two years old and had an infant son at the breast. (Now from this point on the entire account of her ordeal is her own, according to her own ideas and in the way that she herself wrote it down.)
While we were still under arrest (she said) my father out of love for me was trying to persuade me and shake my resolution. 'Father,' said I, 'do you see this vase here, for example, or waterpot or whatever?'
'Yes, I do', said he.
And I told him: 'Could it be called by any other name than what it is?'
And he said: 'No.'
'Well, so too I cannot be called anything other than what I am, a Christian.'
At this my father was so angered by the word 'Christian' that he moved towards me as though he would pluck my eyes out. But he left it at that and departed, vanquished along with his diabolical arguments.
For a few days afterwards I gave thanks to the Lord that I was separated from my father, and I was comforted by his absence. During these few days I was baptized, and I was inspired by the Spirit not to ask for any other favour after the water but simply the perseverance of the flesh. A few days later we were lodged in the prison; and I was terrified, as I had never before been in such a dark hole. What a difficult time it was! With the crowd the heat was stifling; then there was the extortion of the soldiers; and to crown all, I was tortured with worry for my baby there.
Then Tertius and Pomponius, those blessed deacons who tried to take care of us, bribed the soldiers to allow us to go to a better part of the prison to refresh ourselves for a few hours. Everyone then left that dungeon and shifted for himself. I nursed my baby, who was faint from hunger. In my anxiety I spoke to my mother about the child, I tried to comfort my brother, and I gave the child in their charge. I was in pain because I saw them suffering out of pity for me. These were the trials I had to endure for many days.Then I got permission for my baby to stay with me in prison. At once I recovered my health, relieved as I was of my worry and anxiety over the child.My prison had suddenly become a palace, so that I wanted to be there rather than anywhere else.
...
Some days later, an adjutant named Pudens, who was in charge of the prison, began to show us great honour, realizing that we possessed some great power within us. And he began to allow many visitors to see us for our mutual comfort.
...
The military tribune had treated them with extraordinary severity because on the information of certain very foolish people he became afraid that they would be spirited out of the prison by magical spells.
Perpetua spoke to him directly. 'Why can you not even allow us to refresh ourselves properly? For we are the most distinguished of the condemned prisoners, seeing that we belong to the emperor; we are to fight on his very birthday. Would it not be to your credit if we were brought forth on the day in a healthier condition?'
The officer became disturbed and grew red. So it was that he gave the order that they were to be more humanely treated; and he allowed her brothers and other persons to visit, so that the prisoners could dine in their company. By this time the adjutant who was head of the gaol was himself a Christian.
On the day before, when they had their last meal, which is called the free banquet, they celebrated not a banquet but rather a love feast. They spoke to the mob with the same steadfastness, warned them of God's judgement, stressing the joy they would have in their suffering,and ridiculing the curiosity of those that came to see them. Saturus said: 'Will not tomorrow be enough for you? Why are you so eager to see something that you dislike? Our friends today will be our enemies on the morrow. But take careful note of what we look like so that you will recognize us on the day.' Thus everyone would depart from the prison in amazement, and many of them began to believe.
The day of their victory dawned, and they marched from the prison to the amphitheatre joyfully as though they were going to heaven, with calm faces, trembling, if at all, with joy rather than fear. Perpetua went along with shining countenance and calm step, as the beloved of God, as a wife of Christ, putting down everyone's stare by her own intense gaze. With them also was Felicitas, glad that she had safely given birth so that now she could fight the beasts, going from one blood bath to another, from the midwife to the gladiator, ready to wash after childbirth in a second baptism...."
It goes on and on....
But you can see the similarities - the over-the-top, breathless quality, the extremes of emotion, the 'joyfulness' they felt over their suffering and the "victory" that their martyrdom would supposedly give them, the fear and grudging respect of the "worldlies" - er, their persecutors...