Bangalore
Cult Leader Jim Jones's Final Speech
by Bangalore 43 Replies latest jw friends
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Giordano
I was 'out' long before the horror of Jonestown. The witnesses I knew were fine upstanding people it was the doctrine and corporate culture that turned me off........and Armageddon and Blood. Then Jonestown and the horror of the ultimate manipulation of one's belief. Almost 1,000 died by their own hand or forced at gun point to drink the poison along with their children. The whole thing made me reexamine the JW's as well as other groups like the Christian Scientists. When it comes to accepting a teaching or higher authority that decides you must trust in their version of god and drink their version of truth is there any real difference? Witnesses recoil at that comparison........but what's the difference If the outcome is a forced and needless death? Is being compelled to drink poison and drop dead in a field for all the world to see that much different then being compelled to avoid blood when you've been in a serious accident and pass away in surgery or in the privacy of your own home? The first thing an ex JW does is to get that blood card out and toss it away. Because what most of us can agree on is that Needlessly dying for a belief that the WT may not push any longe, like transplants, or die because the blood policy has become a confusing maze as the society leaves their followers twisting in the wind is a belief to dangerous to hold on to. After Jonestown I finally saw the aftermath of the horror of controlling people to the point of death. The horror of the JW's is that their deaths, behind closed doors, surely number more then a 1000 a year and if we go back to the start of the blood prohibition......1945............ how many Jonestown's could the JW's fill with their dead?
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elderelite
Its errie.... Its not the over the top emotion that makes me shiver, its the fact that hes saying NOTHING of any substance. The audiance apears to simply be feeding off of his emotion and seems to "know" what he wants and what they think they should do. Its a group think mindset, the abundance of emotion and fervor... And he never says anything coherent. Very scary indeed that someone can say nothing and people fill in their own interpretation and get swept up in the feeling, ultimatly following someone who is at best mentally unbalanced and at worst a narrcasistic killer. Leasons to be learned for sure.
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Mr. Falcon
Sounds like every goddamn speaker at every District and Circuit Assembly I've ever attended.
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Resistance is Futile
Is there any evidence to support the claim that Jones was a CIA operative?
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james_woods
Is there any evidence to support the claim that Jones was a CIA operative?
No.
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palmtree67
I'm just in the midst of reading "Raven - The Untold Story of Jim Jones and his People".
He took many years to perfect his "persona". He was one way when he was recruiting and preaching to his followers and a totally different way in real life.
At an early age, the book says:
"...he was an actor and a con man. He had cultivated the knack not only for perceiving what people wanted to hear, but also for saying it with a performer's timing......He possessed the self-assurance, imagination, and theatrical ability to fabricate, fantasize or bend a thought or story to suit his needs."
"Although he solicited comments from his followers, they allowed him to scold them. It was clear he was doing their work for them, digesting the material, distilling it, presenting it. Jim was particularlly pleased when they were inquisitive; it meant they were paying attention."
"Helping the disadvantaged was put forth as foremost, but under that was a personal need to be admired, loved and lauded by the crowds."
"Like a little boy who hauled his pets everywhere, he kept his religious flock together; their familiar faces and sheer strength of their numbers helped dispel his own insecurity and create the proper atmosphere for his miraculous sleight of hand."
"....he projected a kind of "us against them" view of the world....but there was another tone as well - that of the petulant, egotistical man impatient with the inattentive, pleased when he had the audience firmly under his control.....He would shout, mockingly secure in his own power, "Either you endure sound doctrine when I preach it, or you don't hear it!"
"Early on, he had grasped an important lesson: an image could serve as well as or better than reality. Religious people, with their eyes and minds on the heavens and their hearts open, were more susceptible to a con job and sleight of hand than most people."
"By the summer of 1961, the attacks on Jones had taken a different tone. Perhaps Jones' publicity and his actions had antagonized bigots. More likely, Jones had exaggerated - and even orchestrated - opposition to his efforts in order to make his integration crusade more dramatic and courageous...."
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still thinking
Wow that's fascinating Palmtree....and thanks Bangalore...I'm going to watch that video.
this bit struck me:
He would shout, mockingly secure in his own power, "Either you endure sound doctrine when I preach it, or you don't hear it!"
I guess he had become pretty secure that his followers believed everything he said before he could talk to them like that.
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rebel8
What I found the most interesting out of that whole story was a scary interview from one of the survivors afterward. She justified it, saying they did "compassionate kills" or something like that. Just shows you how long it takes for brainwashing to loosen its grip (as if we didn't already know from personal experience).