While reading the thread about the JW elder clearing his conscience, I had the thought...
While taking everyone's experiences in the JW ORG at face value, we all certainly had different influences present around us concerning education.
It is clear to me that within the JW ORG, there is a spectrum running from hard-liners to very liberal, in this particular matter.
My question is, what does this do to the JW ORG over time?
I can only guess that this dynamic would tend to stratify things. Liberal families who allow(encourage?) their children to get a college education might not retain their kids in the ORG, but the ones who stay would tend to have better careers; make more money, then the ones whose eschewed higher education.
Families who 'got the message' would tend to stagnate, and the ones who didn't would, more-or-less, drift upward. I could see this breeding some real resentment within congregations.
Differing views of education in the JW cult
by hybridous 12 Replies latest jw friends
-
hybridous
-
wasblind
I personally felt resentment whenever an elder would spew WTS crap about
education not bein' a priority, and tryin' to encourage youngsters to go into
fultime service, while their own were in college
How in the world could they discourage someone elses child
from the very thing their own children had privy too
hypocrits, Those are the very same folks that will tell you what
to do wit your child and do the opposite wit theirs
Assholes
.
-
00DAD
WT Rules and Regulations breed hypocrisy. This is true of any religion. When rules multiply, especially overly-restrictive rules intended to do no more than reinforce the authority of the ruling class, people are going to break them. Often the rule-makers feel that the rules don't apply to them because they made them. Their immediate underlyings get caught in the middle. They don't want to follow them either because they think they're part of the "ruling class," but they know they need to look like loyal subjects to those ruled.
It's clear to me that if Jesus really were to somehow return today, he would completely reject the way JWs misrepresent him.
"He strongly criticized the religious leaders when he said to them: 'You have made the word of God invalid because of your tradition.'—Matthew 15:6." - w10 7/1 p. 4
JWs are brilliant at picking up on the hypocrisy of other religions, but generally turn a blind eye to their own duplicity. Either that or they invent sophisticated excuses to justify why they are some how exempt. This is the definition of hypocrisy.
-
Pyramid Scheme
Here is how my view of education evolved.
I grew up in the 80's, so education was basically taboo. You could finish High School, but college was still verboten. Anyone who went to college was practically marked as bad association and was ostracized in the congregation. If you quit High School and pioneered, you were still looked up favorably. It was never "encouraged" to quit high school, but it certainly wasn't frowned up by most Witnesses either.
As a kid, I was identified as a gifted student. I sailed through elementary school, and entered junior high by enrolling in advanced classes. Due to illness, I missed a great deal of 7th and 8th grade, and got behind. My grades suffered so I was put into "regular" classes. As I entered 9th grade, I turned 14 and got baptised, so my views of education were all dictated by the organization. I knew I wasn't going to college, so why bust my tail to get a high grade point average? I knew I was still a very bright, intellingent kid, but I scoffed at school from there forth. I did the minimum to get by. College was still taboo (I graduated in 1990) and the pressure not to attend was stifling. As I began high school, a friend of mine at the hall was the son of two teachers - he had perfect grades and received a full-ride scholarship to a local university. He attended for one semester, but was so ostracized he quit and started pioneering. Thats right - a full ride scholarship given up due to peer pressure. He attributed it to have an "awakening" and a new found desire to pioneer, but we all knew that was garbage. So, I wasn't going to put myself through that misery......
As a young man with health problems, I knew I would never last as a full time pioneer. I did it for one year, and was so sick. So, here I was 20 years old, with a mediocre high school grade point average, and missed opportunites. I bounced around from a few jobs, and I started and stopped college for 10 years. I knew I wanted a degree, a skill to go with that degree, and also the satisfaction of achieving further education. Of course, as soon as I got serious about it, I was appointed an elder. My time was thus taken up serving up "spiritual food" to the congregation and taking the lead in service, so my dream was deferred further. However, i became a zealot for education - I encouraged every kid I could to take high school serious, seriously consider if they really, really wanted to pioneer (since I never wanted to do it, but I did out of peer pressure), and seriously consider furthering their education. I was blunt and honest with them with my experience. I posted in the other thread of my experience defending a family who sent two daughters to college. When they were attacked by 2 elders regarding it, I imitated Paul and "replied like a madman".......the girls were nice kids, extremely bright, and weren't even baptised. I wasn't going to let them miss out on any opportunity to better themselves, especially by two uneducated bullies.
Finally, I got sick of it and decided to finish my school. I started saying NO at the hall, and went back to college to achieve my bachelor's degree. My career advancement was evident right for the time I got my degree. I got better job offers, and I started making significantly more money. While education is no guarantee for anything, it certainly does open many doors.
My last few years as an elder, I became an outspoken advocate for education. I ruffled a lot of feathers. I had 3 self-employed elders on the body who were window washers and handymen because they could not obtain other employment. While I do not look down on any job, as I have been a custodian and a window washer, I felt bad for 60-70 year old men who had to keep working until they dropped because they couldn't afford to live, much less retire. Their bodies were failing them, but as children of the previous generation, education was scoffed at by Witnesses. A lot of them were genuinely offended by the softened stance toward higher education - some because they were so biased against education, some because they felt screwed by the "old light"
-
irondork
I dont understand whut all the confushun is about. Just reeding the Watchtower and awake magazeens will give you the eqivelent of a coledge ejucation.
I'm serious!
-
trujw
I received a degree in underlining. Was very good at it . helped me to keep a squeegee straight on windows
-
NVR2L8
I was in High School in the late 60s and I quit before graduating because the Awake said I wouldn't have time to go to college or have a career. I also married young because I didn't want to live single eternally. Due to not having a diploma and a family at a young age, I always felt I had to work twice as hard as the next guy to keep my job. This also affected my finances because I didn't earn much for a long while and I didn't believe in investing for retirement. Fortunately I worked under people who saw my potential and they provided me the oportunity to grow within the company where I stayed for almost 30 years. With no Armaggedon in sight I started saving for my retirement and I have done well financially. Still, there is no telling what I could have accomplished if I had the right credentials or if I had used my drive in business rather than in the cult...
-
tiki
Pyramid - I am glad you conquered and got that degree at last. My story lingers longer - I was top honors kid all through school and should have gone straight off to college, but oh the horrors - late 60's - you'd have sex and believe in evolution....so it was out of the question. i always resented it...had to work in retail for minimum wage, tried to pioneer was a major failure at that (hated it too)...eventually took classes at a local college to improve my work prospects and got decent work....eventually faded and now realize that i never really bought into the rhetoric anyway....and six years ago started at long last my pursuit of my degree. will graduate this year and plan to go into a master's program straight away. my job is good - been there over 20 years and while it's okay it doesn't satisfy my need to do something with more depth and interest....so hopefully before i croak i'll have something to do to make good money and use my brain more fully.
i hate and abhor the stigma they put on education. if a kid has the brains, he should be encouraged to go as far as possible. and all kids - every single one of them - should be educated sufficiently so they can support themselves in a comfortable lifestyle. and if in the process of getting that education they develop new ideas and experience different situations and things and even make stupid decisions, that is part of the growth process and is a positive thing.
and (rant) i find it so obnoxious that parents will let their little girls and boys get married as teenagers so they don't have sex without marriage. saddle a kid with an adult responsibility before they grow up. that is just so stupid....and they always end up miserable, have no means of self-support and are stuck on the wheel in the hamster cage.
-
problemaddict
Pyramid. Would you say you made your advancement manifest? :)
Yeah I am just over 30, but I was fully brainwashed into thinking bethel was going to give me a career. Fortunately, I never made it to Bethel, and my unbelieving father forced me to at least go to a medical trade school. So I had something that resembled a skill. From there, I just made good moves, and now I do fairly well running my own buisness.
But my situation is rare. Needless to say I have a 529 in my sons name already, and will be making sure he understands the value of learning, and thinking.
-
WTWizard
They don't look at the consequences of unreasonable rules. You need a decent education these days--just not with the debt burden that often comes with college these days. That should never be up to the hounders or the religion, as all it will do is create problems with students that could have done better. As bad is when children are expected to attend Friday's Grand Boasting Session program on a day when they could well be missing final exams, or staying up on test nights past 10 PM every week. Going in field circus comes before studying and homework.
Anyone else remember the 55 MPH speed limit? How many people obeyed that strictly? If you obeyed the 55 MPH speed limit, did everyone else pass you like you were standing still? And that was with a stupid speed limit. Imagine the disobedience they are setting themselves up for if they trash children's education--missing a Grand Boasting Session and taking your final is like doing 70 when the limit was reduced from 70 to 55. I can only hope the same thing happens with children forced to stay up past their reasonable bedtime or miss studying time for boasting sessions on test nights.