nice one Pterist , they did slip up by misquoting someone who was still alive . I wander what Tertullian etc would have said about the hatchet job done on their writings in "SHOULD YOU BELIEVE IN THE TRINITY? " I think that courts would have been kept very busy with all the litigation !!!!
New World Translation
by MsD 69 Replies latest jw friends
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designs
The problem with the New Testament is the New Testament.
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PSacramento
As Jgnat said, the issue is not (in of itself) that they translate proskueno as "obeisance", but thay they do it base don their doctrine and nOT how it was used by the writer.
They pick and choose when to translate it worship ( when applied to God or satan for example) or obeisance ( when applied to Jesus), disregarding the pattern set forth by the actual writer.
It is the same thing when they insert Jehovah in a NT verse that does NOT have it from the original manuscript on the "excuse' that it is a verse from the OT what has YHWH written, which in theory is fine except that they do NOT follow their own "rule" in that regard.
IMO, the most blatant and gross misuse of this is in Romans 10:13.
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sir82
the reference version of the NWT, take a look at appendix 1D. There is a lengthy listing of other sources that agree with their use of "Jehovah" in the Greek scriptures.
You realize, of course, that the earliest of these "other sources" was written in 1385....well over a millenium after the original Greek writings. Most of the "J" sources were written many centuries after that. And virtually all of those "J" sources are Jews who, apparently in the interest of studying literature, translated the New Testament into Hebrew.
I.e., the Society's "justification" of using "Jehovah" 237 times in the NT boils down to this:
"Apostate Jewish translators, who of course don't believe in Jesus as the son of God at all, used the word 'Jehovah' in place of 'Lord' in some places in their translation of the NT, which translations were made 1300-1900 years after the original Greek manuscripts. Therefore, since these heathen apostate Jews felt justified in doing so, evidently that is exactly what Jehovah wants us to do."
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Jeffro
How to 'translate' the Bible, Watch Tower Society style:
- Start with the text of the King James Version.
- Perform a search-and-replace of archaic terms with modern words (e.g. moveth --> moving; shambles --> meat market, lest ye --> for fear you may)
- Change awkward Old English word order (e.g. he commanded them not --> he had not proscribed for them)
- Replace regular verbs with progressive verbs (e.g. he rested --> proceeded to rest; God called --> God went on to say)
- Change passages where required for doctrinal bias. (e.g. for Babylon --> at Babylon; the angels of God worship him --> And let all God's angels do obeisance to him)
- Proof-read and send to press.
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Wonderment
<!-- @page { margin: 0.79in } P { margin-bottom: 0.08in } A:link { so-language: zxx } -->
It is not the NWT alone who translate proskyneo as
"obeisance," or other, as for example in Heb. 1.6, where
Christ is spoken of:
“ And let them bow before him --all messengers of
God” (Young's Literal Translation)
‘ Now let all messengers of God honour him ’ (Ferrar
Fenton Translation)
“ And let all the angels of God pay him homage”
(George R. Noyes New Testament)
“ And all of God's messengers should bow down to
him.” (A Non-Ecclesiastical NT, Frank Daniel)
“ And prostrate yourselves to him all God's angels” (21 st Century New Testament)
“ And let do obeisance to him all angels of God”
(The Apostolic Bible Polyglot)
“ and let all God's angels do him reverence ” (The
Bible in Living English , Steven T. Byington)
“ Let all the angels of God bow down before him .”
(Open English Bible)
“ And let all the angels of God bow down to him ”
(Riverside New Testament , William G. Ballantine)
“ Dénle homenaje [ Give him homage ] todos los
ángeles de Dios [all angels of God] ” (Pablo
Besson)
“ Let all the messengers of God bow low before
him.”(2001 Translation - An American English
Bible)
“ And let all the messengers of God bow down in
deference to him.” (CGV, Joseph Morovich)
“ Let all the angels of God bow down before him ”
(Twentieth Century New Testament)
“ Let all God’s angels kneel before him.” (Cotton
Patch Version, Clarence Jordan)
“ And let all God's angels bow before him ” (Edgar J.
Goodspeed New Testament)
“ Et que tous les anges de Dieu lui rendent
hommage [And let all angels of God pay him
homage]” (French Darby Bible)
“ And let all God's angels pay him homage” (The
Authentic New Testament , Hugh J. Schonfield)
“ Before him shall bow all messengers of God”
(Andy Gaus New Testament)
“ Let all God's angels pay him homage ” (Revised
English Bible)
“ And may all the angels pay homage to him”
(Heinz W. Cassirer's New Testament)
“ Let all the angels of God pay him homage ” (New
Jerusalem Bible)
Quotes taken from :
http://www.scribd.com/doc/48234022/Did-the-New-World-Translation-Committee-Know-Any-Greek
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Jeffro
Wonderment:
It is not the NWT alone who translate proskyneo as "obeisance,"
The point is not that no other translation has a particular rendering, but that the NWT rendering is usually equivalent to the KJV, except as indicated in the list of 'steps' I gave.
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Wonderment
Jeffro:
How to 'translate' the Bible, Watch Tower Society style:
- Start with the text of the King James Version.
- Perform a search-and-replace of archaic terms with modern words (e.g. moveth --> moving; shambles --> meat market, lest ye --> for fear you may)
- Change awkward Old English word order (e.g. he commanded them not --> he had not proscribed for them)
- Replace regular verbs with progressive verbs (e.g. he rested --> proceeded to rest; God called --> God went on to say)
- Change passages where required for doctrinal bias. (e.g. for Babylon --> at Babylon; the angels of God worship him --> And let all God's angels do obeisance to him)
- Proof-read and send to press.
If the NWT Committe had done what you are suggesting, they could have done their version in two years, not fourteen, which is the time they took to do their original version. Besides, had you done a thorough comparison of the NWT version with the Hebrew and Greek Texts, you would have found out that there are thousands of particulars which cannot be answered by your six suggestions. Thus, I cannot take your suggestions seriously.
I don't agree with all the translation choices of the NWT, just as I do not agree with other Bible versions translation choices all the time. But overall, most translators are sincere, and do a pretty good job at it, the NWT included. All translations fall short somewhere, because they are done by imperfect humans with limited knowledge.
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james_woods
Perhaps they "could have" done it in two years, Wonderment - but they didn't.
How long they took proves nothing.
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Wonderment
Pterist:
I ask of you:
Can you or someone else here show me just one scripture in the Bible where it says:
"God himself took this human flesh upon him." (William Barclay; Many Witnesses, One Lord, p27 )