Just had an elder drop in for a visit

by biometrics 23 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  00DAD

  He started talking about how the Organization doesn't have everything correct and they're starting to acknowledge it.

  Oh puh-leeze! They clearly don't have everything correct, but they're owning up to it is seriously lacking.

  If he's referring to the WTBTS's lame "acknowledgement" of errors in the January 2013 Public Edition of the WT, then let him know that you think that "apology' is too little, too late:

  We have had some wrong expectations about the end. But we are more concerned with obeying Jesus and saving lives than with avoiding criticism. - w2013 1/15, p. 8

  If you or I or anyone else made a serious mistake and offered up such a watered-down excuse for an apology we'd be appropriately deemed unrepentant.

  "Some" wrong expectations? We're ANY of them right? No.

  How does the second sentence excuse, explain or justify their "wrong expectations"? In what way were they "obeying Jesus" by teaching these "wrong expectations" and demanding others accept them or be deemed unrepentant apostates? And please tell me, just how many lives were saved as a result of these "wrong expectations"?

  Come to think of it, these were even "expectations," they were official church doctrines, teachings which were widely disseminated and expected to be accepted as facts by the Rank & File members of Jehovah's Witnesses.

  Also notice the use of "we" to mean ALL JWs, not just the leadership that came up with and promoted these "wrong expectations." If you really read that 1/2 page "mea culpa" you'll find that EVERY SINGLE APPARENT ADMISSION OF ERROR is linked with an eraser phrase, a phrase designed to excuse the mistake and worded in such a way to imply it somehow actually proves their spirituality.

  Check out this beauty:

  We agree with the sentiment of longtime Witness A. H. Macmillan, who said: “I learned that we should admit our mistakes and continue searching God’s Word for more enlightenment.”

  No doubt. See what humble little mistake admitters they are! And notice how submissively they go about studying God's Word "for more enlightenment." They're pretty damn slow about getting any though. Here we are 93 years later and they just realized they've been wrong the whole time about who "The Faithful and Discreet Slave" really is! Seriously! Are they right about anything? Anything?

  It's really a splendid little study in equivocation and doublespeak. Way to take responsibility guys!

  Tell your elder friend he better be careful expressing views such as the ones he shared with you. Talk like that could lead to apostasy.

  00DAD
• 

  00DAD

  jgnat: Without listening there can be no understanding. Without understanding there can be no reconciliation.

  That is really a beautiful statement.

  Sadly the organization is not interested in reconciliation. They just want obedience: Listen, Obey and Be Blessed!
• 

  snare&racket

  See the difference between truth and lies is that if the WT was all about truth, that elder could and would say that from the platform or at the next meeting. But like a scary regime, he would not dare, because of the consequences.

  The ORG demands exclusive devotion and loyalty, such people as this elder would not be tolerated and he knows it, hence he says things in the safe privacy of someone elses home. A 'someone' that could easily be dismissed as untrue if you repeated it to others, an inactive one.

  Truth does not need to be safeguarded, it will be self evident and protect itself, it will be true even if nobody believes it.... lies however need lots of protection from truth, lots of shielding and secrecy.

  Snare x
• 

  under the radar

  Commencing rant.

  "He started talking about how the Organization doesn't have everything correct and they're starting to acknowledge it. How the meeting format has changed, focusing less on 'details' and more on how to live a good life."

  "He also said it he doesn't like the term 'the truth', and thinks it's a presumptuous term, because they don't have 100% truth ."

  "We have had some wrong expectations about the end. But we are more concerned with obeying Jesus and saving lives than with avoiding criticism. - w2013 1/15, p. 8"

  "We agree with the sentiment of longtime Witness A. H. Macmillan, who said: "I learned that we should admit our mistakes and continue searching God's Word for more enlightenment.""

  All the above would be well and good IF the Society didn't require total and unquestioning acceptance of whatever "new light" appeared in the latest WT or was announced at some special meeting. No matter what you were REQUIRED to believe yesterday or might be REQUIRED to believe tomorrow, even though some of those beliefs directly affect peoples' very lives. "Don't bother to ponder, reason, or do outside research on spiritual matters. We have brothers at Bethel who are assigned to do just that! We'll let you know what to think. Don't worry your pretty little heads."

  The Society values "unity" above freedom of conscience and a personal relationship with Jesus. They are presumptious to an astonishing degree, and seem determined to be the masters of your faith. They are spiritual bullies in a very real sense, and I hope they pay a heavy price in the end.

  Rant completed. Resuming normal operations.

  For what it's worth, I agree with the other posters who advised you to be very careful with this "friend." He may be setting you up, even unintentionally. If he repeats anything you've said, even innocently, it could easily lead to an investigation into your "apostate leanings." He may feel compelled to jump on the bandwagon to deflect questions about his own thinking. There is no way this would end well for you. I highly recommend you be as noncommittal as possible. Say little and avoid conversations like this like the plague, unless you are ready to be out of the Borg completely and officially.
• 

  Pterist

  Excellent damage control by the org. However, people have died physically and spiritually because of their definition of TRUTH. John 14:6

  Shalom
• 

  blondie

  So was "he" specific about what he feels is wrong with the WTS and what parts are not "the truth"? Probably not. It is most likely a tactic to draw you out and be specific. That fact that it was just one elder is good. no 2 witnesses.

  Did he just "drop by"? I had that rude way of doing it. No call, no entrance at our house for sure.
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  jookbeard

  if they dont have everything correct then why are they still DF'ing people for apostasy if you vocally disagree with 1 single WTS doctrine, more lies sadly.
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  OnTheWayOut

  More on how to live a good life? Great. Tell 'em I am doing just that. Good day.
• 

  problemaddict

  Truth is singular, all other versions of it are untruths.

  -Cloud Atlas
• 

  ABibleStudent

  Hi biometrics, Ditto what other posters said, especially jgnat, OnTheWayOut, and under the radar.

  Did the elder call before he dropped by? Since it seems from your description that he was giving a soft-sell sales presentation, I don't feel he cares very much about you as an individual. JWs use too many platitudes that are designed to gain empathy and solidify a common ground for them to continue their sales presentation. He was either trying to find out if you are a threat or if he can sell you to come back to keep donating more money to the WTBTS.

  Peace be with you and everyone, who you love,

  Robert